New Gun, couple issues

[Pappabear]

Thanks for all the help everyone. So I didn't get to the range, but I took it into the gun shop today. He moved the rail slightly and told me to go shoot it before he had to do some other adjustments and then bring the target to him. But now the rail is kinked over a little so not sure I'd want it permanently like that. I'm thinking of just taking it to Troy themselves as its a complete upper built by them. They are local to me so I figure why not. Straight to the source. I'm thinking they could either replace it or take a hard look at it and know what needs to be adjusted... saving me rounds and all.

solid plan, since they are local.

PB

[AndyLate]

What would be optimal? I do plan on getting a 1x4 and red dot eventually.

It's fine for a back up sight. The optimal solution would be a sight rigidly mounted to the barrel like the M-16 front sight base.

Andy

[SA80Dan]

It's fine for a back up sight. The optimal solution would be a sight rigidly mounted to the barrel like the M-16 front sight base.

Andy

Agreed for anyone primarily shooting irons.

Ejewels - from what I am gathering I understand you don't want to expend the ammo at the mo - but quite honestly, if you want a dead nuts zero the only way is to shoot it in...and then shoot it some more. I'm OCD about having a zeroed rifle and I'll check it every range day when there are nice still conditions. If by you taking it back to the gun shop and they've cocked that rail off a little bit based on what you've told them, it might have made matters worse. Did you click it right those theoretical 8 clicks before you went back to see what it looked like?

[ScottsBad]

^^^ Yeah. Everyone sees through a sight slightly differently. Two people might not see zero the same way.

To make matters more complicated, different ammo will have different points of impact. So your Wolf Gold might have a different point of impact compared to your Federal XM193, to your IMI M193, etc.

So you need to shoot the rifle. Set the rail back straight, pick the type of ammo you're most likely to shoot. And go sight it in.

This is how you learn to shoot and maintain your rifle. It can be frustrating, a little expensive, and time consuming, but its how you become proficient.

[Steved13]

Thanks for all the help everyone. So I didn't get to the range, but I took it into the gun shop today. He moved the rail slightly and told me to go shoot it before he had to do some other adjustments and then bring the target to him. But now the rail is kinked over a little so not sure I'd want it permanently like that. I'm thinking of just taking it to Troy themselves as its a complete upper built by them. They are local to me so I figure why not. Straight to the source. I'm thinking they could either replace it or take a hard look at it and know what needs to be adjusted... saving me rounds and all.

As others have said, bore sighting is not zeroing in your sights...it's meant to get you on or near the paper. Bench resting and adjusting the sights is "zeroing in". You have/had no reason to bring the gun to anyone else, not the shop, nor troy...just bring it to the range and sight it in properly, this is your job and it should be part of the enjoyment of gun ownership. This is just standard practice with any new sighting system on any gun. If it can't be zeroed then it's time to get the manufacturer or the shop you bought it involved.

[ejewels]

Hey everyone, thanks for the replies. UPDATE:

OK, so after reading and help from you guys and not wanting to shoot it as it was, I decided to take the gun into another shop that I now like better (first time there). They reset the hand rail and tightened everything up for free. So then it was off to the range. After a good 45 minutes, I've finally got her zero'd at 50 yards, resting the rail on a bag. I wore my glasses (which is a very light distance prescription) and the small peep hole on the rear sight. I kept the top of the front sight as best I could in the middle of the round black bullseye (100 yard military target), but since its just a small dot at that distance, you don't really know if you're truly in the center of that small black hole.

Anyways, now my rear sight is almost in the middle! I told the kid at the range that his bore-sighting had me shooting 2" left and he said "it just was to get you on paper". Something still seems fishy with that bore sight he did since I was pretty far out left. The only concern I may have now, is I had to adjust my front sight pretty far up. I've attached pics of the front for you guys to see where its at... hoping all is OK.

IMG_0180.jpg

[ScottsBad]

Hey everyone, thanks for the replies. UPDATE:

OK, so after reading and help from you guys and not wanting to shoot it as it was, I decided to take the gun into another shop that I now like better (first time there). They reset the hand rail and tightened everything up for free. So then it was off to the range. After a good 45 minutes, I've finally got her zero'd at 50 yards, resting the rail on a bag. I wore my glasses (which is a very light distance prescription) and the small peep hole on the rear sight. I kept the top of the front sight as best I could in the middle of the round black bullseye (100 yard military target), but since its just a small dot at that distance, you don't really know if you're truly in the center of that small black hole.

Anyways, now my rear sight is almost in the middle! I told the kid at the range that his bore-sighting had me shooting 2" left and he said "it just was to get you on paper". Something still seems fishy with that bore sight he did since I was pretty far out left. The only concern I may have now, is I had to adjust my front sight pretty far up. I've attached pics of the front for you guys to see where its at... hoping all is OK.

IMG_0180.jpg

Welcome to the world of firearms. Happy you got out there to shoot. Yes, the target is small, this is no video game. Happy you got the rifle zero'd. Think you are frustrated now, wait until you change ammo, or start shooting out to 100 yards.

OCD much? It doesn't look abnormal. And it doesn't matter how high the post is (within reason) if it works for you.

Stop bugging the guy who did the bore sight, its done to get you on paper, not give you absolute zero. 2" left from a bore sight is pretty decent.

We are all a little obsessive about our firearms, but you need to keep getting out there and shooting to gain enough experience so you, at least, sound like you know when there is actually a problem.

Good luck.

[SA80Dan]

Agree, the boresight kid did him a favor and as you say if he eyeballed it to 2 inches off at 50 that's hardly bad - it served its purpose to get there or thereabouts.

[ejewels]

Thanks guys, good to know the front sight looks ok. I'm going to a 25 yard next, and will expect to shoot lower now I believe? I can't wait until I get a red dot, but I'm liking the old school iron shooting.

[26 Inf]

Thanks guys, good to know the front sight looks ok. I'm going to a 25 yard next, and will expect to shoot lower now I believe? I can't wait until I get a red dot, but I'm liking the old school iron shooting.

Yes. If you think about it, the sights have to be adjusted to raise the strike of the bullet 2.5 inches (roughly) at 50 yards to account for the distance between the sights and the rifle bore. So 25 yards is halfway to 50 yards, so you might see 1.25ish low.

Here is what the trajectory charts at using the Hornady Ballistic Calculator (xm193 is the military 5.56 55gr cartridge):

The red circle shows the bullet 2.5 inches low (because the barrel is below the sights) at 25 yards;

The blue circle shows the NEAR ZERO at 50 yards;

The green circle shows the FAR ZERO between 200 and 225 yards.

Your Troy sight's apertures should be same plane, which means the center of each aperture is at the same point above the bore. So it shouldn't make any difference which aperture you use, small or large.

XM193 Trajectory - 50 yard zero.JPG

Hope this helps.