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Thread: Tikka T3x Tac A1 vs Seekins Havak Bravo vs DD Delta 5 vs ???

  1. #11
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    Yeah I’m thinking Jack L. is spot on with his advice, and I know he has quite a bit of experience competing in matches and setting them up through Quantified Performance.

    I went through and read up on class rules for PRS production division and also looked at NRL. More NRL events within reasonable distances from me in the Black Hills than there are PRS events. At any rate I notice that PRS production class now allows $2500 for the rifle as advertised MSRP, and that opens up something like the MPA PMR Pro, which is pretty much where I would have ended up anyway.

  2. #12
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    I have the DD gun and it is a laser beam, but for the price you could buy a Bergar LRP and be into a very nice gun as well for a bit cheaper. I own and shoot both quite a bit. Can be had in 6 and 6.5CM. I shoot a 6.5 in gas guns and bolt gun. I'm impressed with this cartridge after fighting not liking it over 308. The factory options are amazing for cheap to very good from .65 to $1.25 that shoot .25 to 1 inch MOA.

    Ive considered buying a 6.5 barrel for the DD gun. Not as easy to swop out as my MWS, but doable for a regular guy.

    Read up on the Bergara line and see if you like them. I would add them to the consideration.

    PB
    "Air Force / Policeman / Fireman / Man of God / Friend of mine / R.I.P. Steve Lamy"

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pappabear View Post
    I shoot a 6.5 in gas guns and bolt gun. I'm impressed with this cartridge after fighting not liking it over 308. The factory options are amazing for cheap to very good from .65 to $1.25 that shoot .25 to 1 inch MOA.
    OP handloads as do I, but as the guy who built a 260 just before the 6.5 came out I'm a bit envious of it's wide availability of quality factory ammo.

    Don't underestimate the value of practice, being able to buy a box of ammo and go shoot rather than stay home and load will get you further than the "best" caliber.

  4. #14
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    I usually start with some factory ammo to get a baseline and ensure function, and it’s always nice to be able to grab a few boxes of factory ammo if I am behind on reloading chores.

    Been staring down the rabbit hole of custom actions, chassis, and triggers. Holy hell it’s a $$$ abyss if you fall all the way in.

  5. #15
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    It's not that much to get into fun LR. Competition and/or chasing the latest/best is entirely different.

    I took an old R700, got a used police stock, and a nice pac-nor blank. I was able to contour and chamber it myself but with the savage jam nut barrels available anyone with a few tools can re barrel an action.

    I don't do any competition so a little adjustment to the factory trigger was good enough and I haven't needed to spend money to convert to DBM. I'm pretty confident every time I miss it's me and not my gear.

    So I guess I'll recommend anything with a good reputation for factory accuracy in 6.5CM to get started, and then see how far down the hole shooting it takes you.

  6. #16
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    i think you've got some solid advice here. I started shooting matches in outlaw days before the PRS started and I'm amazed today at the breadth of reasonably priced rifles and cartridges available. it's just phenomenal. i know, blah blah walk to school uphill in the snow both ways blah blah haha. but back then everyone shot 260rem or 243win and you couldn't even buy a factory rifle with the right twist in either cartridge, so everything was custom. actions and chassis have come a LONG way too. It's almost hard to go wrong these days. Of the 3 though, I'd go seekins.

    some random opinions for you:

    if you want some light reading, here's an interesting thread on another forum where a friend who was a benchrest shooter gets into practical precision competition starting in 2018. it's over 1100 posts long now, but has a lot of great info. he evaluated several, eventually bought the seekins and wasn't super happy with it (but i still recommend them) and he eventually got an Impact/foundation like mine. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...tion-s.845206/

    Impact/foundation is spendy, but the quality cannot be beat. pics and info on mine here https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...-owned.836725/

    MPA chassis are great. I'm not a huge fan of their actions though.

    Definitely go with something that takes pre-fit barrels.

    If you want to get a little bleeding edge you can split the difference between 6mm and 6.5mm now as there are some quality 25cal match bullets being made. but even though the 6mm dominate competitions like PRS and own most of the benchrest records, I still love the 6.5. If i had it to do over again, I'd still be shooting the 260AI and would have just moved from berger vld to hybrids to jlk to hornady A-tips over the years. as it stands, i spend most of my time behind dashers and 6.5x47L

    factory ammo is REALLY good these days. at least some of it. hornady creedmoor ammo is awesome and won't keep you from winning matches. wish i could afford it lol

    weight is something to consider. just like trends oscillate from super light to heavy AR15s, same happens in PRS. I sort of started a trend years ago by taking the plastic spacers out of the butt and making a mold and creating sold lead spacers to add weight to my competition rifle. it's impressive how much an extra 5 LB in the stock will help you hold steady, see trace, and make positions like sitting easier. it's not much fun to hump a 22 lb rifle around though. Trend these days seems to be going back to lighter weight rifles. I don't know how the 3 in the op compare in terms of mass, but it's something to consider. an advantage to chassis like MPA is that you can easily add and remove weights to them.

  7. #17
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    Thanks for the input, I noticed that MPA uses Curtis Custom actions, what specifically do you dislike about them?

    Of the custom actions I have considered picking up and putting the rifle together over time (an option I might entertain), I might pick your brain a bit if you’re willing.

    We know you like the Impact Precision 737.

    Do you have any experience with the Bighorn TL-3? Looks interesting for the ability to easily swap breech face/bolt heads to run a variety of calibers if desired. Takes pre-fits no problem, evidently to include shouldered pre-chambered barrels.

    How are the various Defiance actions, I ask because the Badrock Precision production class rifle runs a Defiance made action in an MDT chassis.

    Lone Peak Fusion any good?

    Aside from saving 30 degrees of travel is a three lug 60 degree worth my time over a 90 degree two lug? I assume cocking effort is shorter travel and therefore higher effort on the 3 lug, but you have more clearance between bolt handle and ocular housing on the scope. Is that juice worth the squeeze?

    Does Altus Shooting offer a well done barreled action? I could order any of those actions with a Bartlein tube installed for about $2400 or so, and then order a chassis and trigger later. I notice Trigger Tech is bringing a 2 stage to market, and I do love a fine 2 stage trigger.

  8. #18
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    I'll be as honest as I can, but a little vague because I don't want to rehash a lot of drama.

    I like Curtis actions and they're good dudes and one of my best friends was sponsored by them so i'm not going to dog them too much, but as of last year, I think they still had some bugs to work out reliability-wise. My knowledge may be dated but I thought MPA used two different actions, one higher end (curtis) and one lower end.

    I tried to post an attachment here that will give you a list of gear I used by year, so you can see which ones I have experience with, but I had one of the first Bighorns. It was amazingly accurate and the smoothest action I've ever run. Shot out about 11 barrels with it, iirc. Wouldn't eject worth a crap. I spent a lot of time clearing malfs on the clock. So I got one of the 2nd gen Bighorns, which was supposed to solve that issue. It did not. Same story. Then AJ sold the company and I suspect the new guys weren't' taking any chances. gen 3 went to a fixed ejector. But I wasn't taking any chances either and switched to surgeon.

    Defiance is an awesome company. You can expect anything they put out to be very well machined. However, they're the real "custom" shop in the market. You can get them to do anything you want (from a long list of different options). The challenge with that is, you'd better know what you want because you can easily spec something that doesn't work. The Deviant and Rebel are totally trouble free. I've owned a few and know lots and lots of people who never had any problems. No experience with their newer rukus which takes prefits, but I wouldn't hesitate to get one. It and the impact are the two I would use. My point is just because defiance makes actions for someone else's private label doesn't mean that action will be as reliable as a defiance. I would pay attention to how much clearance the bolt has though. some folks spec benchrest type clearance and defiance does it well, but that may not be what you need if you're rolling around in the dirt out west with it.

    no experience with lone peak.

    i don't have strong opinion on 60 vs 90* throws. it's personal preference i think. as a lefty, i can't tell you how many times i've smashed a finger on the S&B PMII illumination housing. 60* would have helped for sure, but i didn't have one. also pay attention to whether the bolt handle is swept back or not, as that can give you the space you need or put you in a bind, depending.

    I'm not sure who does Altus' work. I thought it was Robert Gradous, who just passed away this month He did fantastic work and was a hoot to hang out with. I stayed at his cabin in the swamp many times while he was putting barrels on bighorns for me. He will be missed. If you ask them and they say it was Gradous, i wouldn't hesitate to buy.

    as an old HP shooter, I love 2 stage too even though dang near all my PRS friends shot with single stages. I shot with the x-treme mod22 which was an amazing 2 stage that was made by Tom Myers (same guy who made all Remington's titanium actions) and was a copy of the old cg-jackson trigger. Never had one go down, even when everyone else was squirting lighter fluid in theirs. However, they're big. and they won't fit in impacts. So when i switched from surgeons to impacts, i decided to make the switch to single stage and the triggertech diamond. It is a fantastic single stage. but dang if AI didn't switch to the cg-jacksons and then all my friends discovered how good that trigger is and changed. shooters are a funny bunch.
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  9. #19
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    Thanks.

  10. #20
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    Narrowing this down and revising my budget upwards, incidentally PRS has moved their production price cap up as well. So if I buy a complete rifle the new PRS production class price cap is $2500 and under.

    Considering the MPA, Badrock Precision, and the new American Rifle Co offerings in their production class offerings.

    https://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa...etition-rifle/

    https://badrockrifles.com/#!/Intro

    https://www.americanrifle.com/shop/p...00?category=26

    Have to say the ARC chassis looks the most promising because it will give more of a grip interface I like on a bolt gun, and the material is 7075 T6 so it’s going to be considerably stronger than the 6065 of the other two.

    My other option is to go full retard, and have Long Rifles Inc build me a rifle. They’re effectively local to me, and are known to do good work. I have heard that the head man in charge there STRONGLY prefers the American Rifle Co Mausingfield action, so that will be a considerably more expensive proposition but will also give me local pro support. If it’s jacked up I can drive up to the shop and drop it off to be made right.

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