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Thread: Pricing, Value Proposition, and Solvency

  1. #1
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    Pricing, Value Proposition, and Solvency

    I’m mostly going to copy/paste from a rabbit trail that started on the Deals thread. My proposition is this:
    Colt makes quality, known products that typically (nearly always) function well, though not always cosmetically perfect. They are the originators of the M4 and the longest builders of the AR-15 family. However, their value has not maintained due to lack of innovation, with subjectively and/or objectively better products from competitors available for the same price or less.

    My original comment:
    Originally Posted by JediGuy View Post
    I can identify with this, as my company never competes on price: we compete on value. Our service is by far the best in the industry, so we charge accordingly.
    The difficulty with Colt is that...at $1200 for a semi-auto, 1.5” extra long, M4 heat shield as handguards, carbine-gassed, gov’t profile carbine... They are well into the territory of other solid manufacturers that provide improvements at the same price point.
    For a coarse analogy... You can’t charge a premium to ship a pallet, if your service is equivalent to other shippers (and good)...but your competitors offer online tracking and you don’t.
    Pardon the aside. I love my CCU, and a complete CCU is probably worth $1200. Not so sure about a 6920. I have a feeling that Colt wasn’t selling at $1200 and was forced to drop their price to move product.
    And Stickman’s response:

    Let’s start a new thread on this topic if you are up for it. Title it whatever you want and drop it in this section. I think there are a lot of arguments both ways for what you are saying.
    Stick
    “God doesn’t need your good works, but your neighbor does.” - Luther

    Quote Originally Posted by 1168
    7.5” is the Ed Hardy of barrel lengths.

  2. #2
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    I agree with this premise 100%, Colt could sell a lot more at higher prices if they would build mid length gas and 14.5's
    “The Trump Doctrine is ‘We’re America, Bitch.’ That’s the Trump Doctrine.”

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    I see Colt as the '95 Toyota Camry of rifles- it's not fancy, nothing groundbreaking, reliable and just keeps on running.
    Philippians 2:10-11

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    Quote Originally Posted by flenna View Post
    I see Colt as the '95 Toyota Camry of rifles- it's not fancy, nothing groundbreaking, reliable and just keeps on running.
    Fair enough.
    But you don’t spend $8,000 on it, either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JediGuy View Post
    Fair enough.
    But you don’t spend $8,000 on it, either.
    Well, that is true. Unless you really like the "T" logo on the front of your car .
    Last edited by flenna; 07-11-20 at 08:02.
    Philippians 2:10-11

    To argue with a person who renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. ~ Thomas Paine

    “The greatest conspiracy theory is the notion that your government cares about you”- unknown.

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    I'm not sure I understand the discussion, I'm basing my response on this:

    The difficulty with Colt is that...at $1200 for a semi-auto, 1.5” extra long, M4 heat shield as handguards, carbine-gassed, gov’t profile carbine... They are well into the territory of other solid manufacturers that provide improvements at the same price point.

    I agree. There have been numerous articles, podcasts, and videos, describing Colt's problems. The consensus seems to be that Colt ignored the civilian market in terms of product development and relied too heavily on military contracts. When faced with competition in the government contract arena they faltered.

    They were significantly behind the general market in introducing ML gas systems and free float rails. Do they even offer an optimized trigger group?

    There are clearly better options available for similar or less money, so Colt has an uphill battle from this point forward, IMO.

    At this point, I think much of the love for Colt is just dogma, fueled by internet sites such as this one.
    Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President... - Theodore Roosevelt, Lincoln and Free Speech, Metropolitan Magazine, Volume 47, Number 6, May 1918.

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    Go back 15 years ago, and Colts were selling for well over 1K. IIRC, 1100 wasn't uncommon at all. Colt (IMHO) only hurt themselves when they started playing price wars with other companies. Instead of going with the flow and developing new weapons that WERE NOT MIL SOLICITATION, Colt stayed with its tried and true offerings. Colt was ahead of the pack for a long time in terms of both quality, and offerings. Everyone else followed along and wanted to be "just as good as Colt".

    Colt now dabbles a little into the midlength market, but they still don't seem to get where the market is. Instead of improving their lineup as they did with the Midlength Centurion Arms railed model, they dumped the price on their carbines. Once the price goes down, people perceive the value as low. If Noveske decided to start selling for half their current prices, people would quickly blow them off.
    Stick


    Board policy mandates I state that I shoot for BCM. I have also done work for 200 or so manufacturers within the firearm community. I am prior service, a full time LEO, firearm instructor, armorer, TL, martial arts instructor, and all around good guy.

    I also shoot and write for various publications. Let me know if you know cool secrets or have toys worthy of an article...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stickman View Post
    Once the price goes down, people perceive the value as low. If Noveske decided to start selling for half their current prices, people would quickly blow them off.
    This reality, combined with the aforementioned lack of product improvement/offerings, equals a company with a really tough road ahead.
    “God doesn’t need your good works, but your neighbor does.” - Luther

    Quote Originally Posted by 1168
    7.5” is the Ed Hardy of barrel lengths.

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    Yeah, Colt hasn’t exactly been an “innovation leader” for a while now. It seems that people buy a Colt to have that one carbine that just runs... then they buy a four other brands to get the stuff they want.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Headache View Post
    Yeah, Colt hasn’t exactly been an “innovation leader” for a while now. It seems that people buy a Colt to have that one carbine that just runs... then they buy a four other brands to get the stuff they want.
    Colt may very well be one of the best AR15s to buy as a base gun, but like you mentioned, it doesn't seem many people leave them as is. They get other guns or get to modifications...
    Stick


    Board policy mandates I state that I shoot for BCM. I have also done work for 200 or so manufacturers within the firearm community. I am prior service, a full time LEO, firearm instructor, armorer, TL, martial arts instructor, and all around good guy.

    I also shoot and write for various publications. Let me know if you know cool secrets or have toys worthy of an article...


    Flickr Tumblr Facebook Instagram RECOILMAGAZINE OFF GRID RECOIL WEB

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