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Thread: I want a 9mm 1911. I thought I wanted an STI until...

  1. #1
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    I want a 9mm 1911. I thought I wanted an STI until...

    I have been reaching out to folks to try and answer that question and I’m only more confused. Some things I’ve heard are that guns like Nighthawk and Chambers are better and Staccato P’s are mag finicky and have problems. P’s are gamer guns. Etc.

    First, I’m generally not one to fixate on price. I know you get what you pay for and if it’s what I need then that’s the price to pay. But I don’t know enough about any of these guns to understand why a Staccato P is $1999 and a Nighthawk or Chambers is on the wrong side of $5000. To me, it’s like I can have a $65,000 BMW which is very nice or a $280,000 Lamborghini which is of course nicer but completely unnecessary.

    Second, Chambers lists a 36-48 MONTH lead time for builds. Even if this is for a truly custom gun that I won’t be buying, any company that lists 4 years for build times is a huge red flag. That’s insane and completely laughable. Are these guys searching the earth for the iron to pull directly out of the ground with which to forge my frame? Nah. The Empire State Building was made in less than two years. Hell we were only at war with Nazi Germany for 42 months!

    Third, and this is a me problem, but I would probably still carry a Glock. I of course want any gun I buy to run 100% but the differential in accuracy a 1911 provides isn’t making up for the weight and muscle memory penalties. So, is a $5k gun that can’t be used at night or shoot 1,000 yards really necessary?

    Help me.

    Sincerely,
    A Glock fanboy who is growing up.
    Last edited by Eurodriver; 08-09-20 at 09:50.

  2. #2
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  3. #3
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    Chambers sources Tamahagane directly from Japan for his guns.
    : )

    The second Gen STI Mags are totally GTG. You’re hearing complaints on the first Gen mags.

    Custom guns are expensive and the best smiths have a tremendous backlog.
    Look for a used gun- try 1911Addicts classifieds.
    or
    Buy a Wilson/Nighthawk/whatever.
    or
    Buy a DW. They’re GTG with a lower price point and little, if any MIM.
    A true "Gun Guy" (or gal) should have familiarity and a modicum of proficiency with most all firearms platforms.

  4. #4
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    Personally, I'd get a Wilson and be done with it. Which 1911 and in what config you get depends on what you plan to do with it. Me, I was someone who was all about 1911as, and CCWd a government 1911 for a decade plus, who went to polymer wonder pistols when for me, "the math" favoring the 1911 just didn't hold up anymore.

    But, a high end 1911 is a beautiful thing if that's where you wanna drop some $.

    Finally, I'd add that between high end 1911's and Glocks, there's a lot of choices out there today.
    - Will

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  5. #5
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    I felt like a commie for the few months I didn’t have a 1911 but got tired of buying .45 for one gun so I sold it and bought a 9mm one. As badly as I wanted a Gucci one, I’m glad I got a cheap SA RO Elite Operator. It was about $1k and Wilson’s 9mm single stack mags have a good reputation and are reasonable in cost.

    It’s really just a toy or nostalgia piece for me. I shoot my Glocks 99% of the time so anymore money would really have been a waste. But I’m glad I have one - that and the M1 are my only guns in that category now and they spend months at a time in the safe, if not more.


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  6. #6
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    For carry? I'd consider aluminum-framed pistols, takes your unloaded weight from 40-42 oz, down to around 30.

    DW TCP
    DW ECP
    Vigil Commander
    DW Specialist Commander (this one is steel frame)

    Or....
    C&S
    Wilson (also worth giving the EDX X9 a look)

  7. #7
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    If you’d ever hand fit a 1911, it isn’t uncommon to spend 60-80 hours on one. Throw on top of that machining all the slides and small parts from blanks, then send-outs for finishing, it really isn’t a fast process. When you’re one of the best in the business, you’re going to get a back log.

    You can get a Nighthawk or Wilson for less than 5k if you’re wanting a 1911...I think any Nighthawk you can make a 2011 for $650. I believe $350 for a dot mount if that’s your thing.

    On STIs, errrr....Staccatos, they are under new ownership and have new tooling. They are making a hard push into the “tactical” realm hiring brand ambassadors and doing the big social media push. Claims are they’ve greatly improved, especially with tooling for the new mags. In fact, they have dropped many of the gamer models from their line. Are they any good? I’ve seen complaints on several forums and those claiming to have problems with them, but that’s anecdotal at best.

    The late-production STI guns were a joke at the gun games and most claimed they needed to go to a gunsmith after purchase to be tuned.

    On Gen 2 magazines, many report that they do run....how much is first hand or regurgitating what has been said by brand ambassadors? I do not know. Shooting USPSA there have been a few guys that purchased the Gen 2 magazines and they just didn’t run without tuning in their 2011s. Maybe they do run in factory Staccatos. I cannot say.

    I was close to pulling the trigger on one myself a few months back, even had a friend that could get me an industry discount. He bought one and he just wasn’t that impressed. He complained it was heavier than a Glock to the point he hated carrying it, on most drills he wasn’t any faster or more accurate than a Glock. It made him get lazy on recoil control (combination of grip angle and weight), and finally he decided the only advantage for him was B8s at 25.

    I started with 1911s but no longer have much interest in a .45 ACP due to recoil, training cost, etc, but I do find myself very interested in a Dan Wesson single-stack in 9mm.


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  8. #8
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    1911’s are iconic. Owning one at least is part of any collection; if you aren’t a collector, your criteria change.

    If you’re just looking for a 1911, the usual names are Wilson and Nighthawk. But Ed Brown makes a very nice weapon, for reasonable price point. They are currently selling an EVO model for about $2200. I have on. It is not as light as a Glock, but it is very nice to shoot. Indeed, it is one of my more fun guns at the range. Shoots 9mm, so easier on “gas and brakes” so to speak. About the only thing I don’t like about it is that it does not relieve tension of the recoil spring when you take it down; I consider that a PITA. I also had a larger mag release and safety put on it, but that’s me.

  9. #9
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    Euro-

    I’d encourage you to shoot a Staccato before dropping that kind of coin on one.

    Couple things;
    The post above refers to “late STIs” having fitment issues. I can sign off on that.
    Our small group has 7 of last years/2019 guns.
    6 of those had marginal to poor barrel fit and 5 had exceptionally poor extractor install, like failure to function poor.
    While all of these were fairly simple fixes, it shouldn’t have been necessary with the guns in question ranging from 2K to 4K.

    One of the guys has a new Duo. I checked it out for him and saw no concerns, this would support Staccato having tightened up their QC, but is obviously a sample of ONE.

    Another issue is grip size.
    If you have manly (normal/large) hands its a moot point.
    If you have medium or small hands, the grip is gonna be on the outside of controllable.

    Even with these caveats and personally owning several custom and an idiotic number of semi customs; my STIs are the pistols I shoot 95% of the time.
    20/27 rds trumps 10/11 rds.
    A true "Gun Guy" (or gal) should have familiarity and a modicum of proficiency with most all firearms platforms.

  10. #10
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    Regarding chambers 3-4 year wait, that is not at all unusual for custom 1911 smiths of known quality. A bunch of really skilled smiths are not even taking orders anymore and have similar wait times.
    If you want a basic single stack 1911 there are plenty of 1k ish price range pistols out there
    Several quality semi customs like Wilson les Baer and others in the 2500-3500 range if you want something a touch more refined.

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