Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 90

Thread: 77gr smk 11.5” barrel

  1. #71
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Canyon Ferry MT
    Posts
    229
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by PracticalRifleman View Post
    I work trauma intensive care. I also have a very strong grasp for anatomy, physiology, and have knowledge about what happens to living tissue post-mortem. I’ve also done my fair share of eating groceries as well as butchering my own meat. I can recognize the differences between groceries and living human beings. Furthermore, I have read the writings of wound ballistics experts and none of them advocate shooting groceries to determine efficacy of a given load.

    If you have desire to hear what the experts say, please consult them instead of watching Paul Harrell.

    Any other questions I can help you with?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Thanks for the detailed reply. Although my post was deliberately sarcastic, I can understand your feedback better.

  2. #72
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Posts
    1,253
    Feedback Score
    0

    77gr smk 11.5” barrel

    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMarine View Post
    While Paul's tests are not as realistic as testing on a live human, pumped up on captagon, they do reveal some useful info.

    For example, out of four or five rounds, none blew up, none penciled through. They all deformed to some degree and caused serious damage to the target.

    Not everybody will accept that information as useful, but I do.
    It does tell us exactly how a round performs in THAT medium. Many aren’t too concerned about how rounds perform shooting groceries. If my home is someday invaded by the the contents of the meat department and the fruit isle, Paul’s testing could be quite useful.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  3. #73
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Canyon Ferry MT
    Posts
    229
    Feedback Score
    0
    What I can glean from Paul's test is distilled down to something like this,

    Even from a 11.5" or 10.5" barrel, A center mass, armpit level, hit from a 77gr OTM, is most likely going to close out your health record rather fast.

  4. #74
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Posts
    1,253
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMarine View Post
    Thanks for the detailed reply. Although my post was deliberately sarcastic, I can understand your feedback better.
    All good.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #75
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Lowcountry, SC.
    Posts
    6,175
    Feedback Score
    30 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMarine View Post
    What I can glean from Paul's test is distilled down to something like this,

    Even from a 11.5" or 10.5" barrel, A center mass, armpit level, hit from a 77gr OTM, is most likely going to close out your health record rather fast.
    Its pretty bad for your health for sure.
    RLTW

    Former Action Guy
    Disclosure: I am affiliated PRN with a tactical training center, but I speak only for myself. I have no idea what we sell, other than CLP and training. I receive no income from sale of hard goods.

  6. #76
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Canyon Ferry MT
    Posts
    229
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by PracticalRifleman View Post
    It does tell us exactly how a round performs in THAT medium. Many aren’t too concerned about how rounds perform shooting groceries. If my home is someday invaded by the the contents of the meat department and the fruit isle, Paul’s testing could be quite useful.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    So, what test medium do you feel is the best approximation to live humans?

    I do look at a lot of gel tests too. And I easily agree it is probably the most consistent test medium for comparing bullets against other bullets.

    But humans are not quite gel blocks either.

  7. #77
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Posts
    1,253
    Feedback Score
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMarine View Post
    So, what test medium do you feel is the best approximation to live humans?

    I do look at a lot of gel tests too. And I easily agree it is probably the most consistent test medium for comparing bullets against other bullets.

    But humans are not quite gel blocks either.
    Gel blocks are good for a consistent medium to compare rounds. It was never meant to approximate human flesh.

    What we can do is look at real shootings and notice trends. Then we can compare how the rounds used in real world shootings to to how they perform in ballistics gelatin. The “real world shooting” trends tend to show a consistent pattern in gelatin blocks.

    The problem trying to replicate human tissue is that there is too much variability. Does the round contact hard bones? Just ribs? Hollow organs? In addition to variance in the anatomical location of the wound, we must consider that human beings themselves are built differently. You see, shooting a piece of dead pork rib doesn’t predict results even if you’re trying to represent a human rib which has the benefit of being covered in fascia, connective tissue, some amount of muscle, multiple layers of very elastic skin, and so on.

    Rounds that excel in the FBI testing protocol, in spite of its short comings, tend to be well-balanced rounds with consistent results.

    The trends I’ve seen in working trauma are those shot with any FMJ from a handgun that isn’t a perfect shot, any .22 lr, or any form of birdshot are rather unimpressive. I’ve seen multiple bad guys that were shot with such and had to be taken down by police AFTER the homeowner or defender discharged all their rounds.

    At the same time, anything 9mm and up with perfect shot placement using duty ammo tends to work and work quickly.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #78
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    KCMH
    Posts
    2,985
    Feedback Score
    0
    Some good info in here, thanks to all. Starting to reload .223. Plenty of consideration to bullet choice.

  9. #79
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Phoenix, Az
    Posts
    4,374
    Feedback Score
    1 (100%)
    Ive posted here before about my experiences with M262. I was a designated marksman for my platoon in 2005 and carried a SDM-R loaded with M262 (77 SMK). I shot a guy at a map measured 400 meters +/- 10. I hit the guy low in the abdomen just below the belly button. Dropped the guy right away and he was out of the fight. He ended up abandoned by his comrades and the medic that saw him told me he had two small exit wounds in his lower back. So it did fragment at that range which should put it around 2000 FPS impact velocity. But truthfully the bullet could have hit bone and fragmented.

    My team leader who later went SF told me his Mk18 and M262 was money out to past 400.
    C co 1/30th Infantry Regiment
    3rd Brigade 3rd Infantry Division
    2002-2006
    OIF 1 and 3

    IraqGunz:
    No dude is going to get shot in the chest at 300 yards and look down and say "What is that, a 3 MOA group?"

  10. #80
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    8,431
    Feedback Score
    9 (100%)
    Quote Originally Posted by C-grunt View Post
    Ive posted here before about my experiences with M262. I was a designated marksman for my platoon in 2005 and carried a SDM-R loaded with M262 (77 SMK). I shot a guy at a map measured 400 meters +/- 10. I hit the guy low in the abdomen just below the belly button. Dropped the guy right away and he was out of the fight. He ended up abandoned by his comrades and the medic that saw him told me he had two small exit wounds in his lower back. So it did fragment at that range which should put it around 2000 FPS impact velocity. But truthfully the bullet could have hit bone and fragmented.

    My team leader who later went SF told me his Mk18 and M262 was money out to past 400.
    I gotta think those 77's would be devastinging our past 500. But you guys know betta

    PB

Page 8 of 9 FirstFirst ... 6789 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •