Tulsa, OK, slain officer Bodycam. *NSFW* hard to watch.

[Firefly]

Again, not arguing with you, just trying to get the info straight.

You've done it plenty of times as a law enforcement officer on duty? If so, is that a legal striking technique? I thought the LEO are restricted to only certain type of strikes, location, etc.

Actually in current training this is addressed as a “weapon of opportunity”. You can even stab someone if need be.

Obviously you can’t just run up to someone and beat their head in. But if you have exhausted every other recourse and it’s looking bad; then game on.

It’s the totality of circumstances that is the meter. I mean if you do not get the perp under control then you can get shot, dragged, or WORSE. I myself have been dragged and it was not fun.

All over literally nothing. Like, maybe it’s just me. But all the times I came close to getting killed it was over something cosmically minor like weed or a Child Support Warrant. The guy with a few keys of coke just want their phone call and either to flip on someone or just clam up until the lawyer comes.

I mean, you do what you have to. I won’t sit here and say “Oh yeah they teach flashlight tune ups all day in Forsyth”. I WILL say that it can get sketchy and sometimes you have to bring the pain if you don’t want to get killed or maimed.

I have rung bells for people grabbing at my gun, shoving something I didn’t know what it was in my face, trying to put a car in gear, trying to snatch up a baby when told they were under arrest( as an aside, there is indeed a certain demographic of males who want nothing to do with their kids all day long until the police show up and then they want to have a baby in their goddamned hands), and coming at me with what was revealed to be a tire iron.

So....let your conscience be your guide.

Don’t go thinking it’s like Quickdraw Mcgraw where you just go bashing someone’s head over a humbug.

I’m just saying it’s doable in a car cab if you know what you’re doing.

[Firefly]

This old cat demonstrated how fast things can happen. If a fat old country boy can do it that quick, just imagine a guy half his age and only 2/3 his weight

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w5u32jFfXU

That’s a good video but I had to stop watching it.

[Firefly]

I'm not advocating vigilante justice, but I live in a part of the world where if an emergency call on the Thrane Satellite phone is made to the Sheriff's Office, it will take 45 minutes to 1 hour for a responding officer to show up - in good weather. You learn from an early age that being self-sufficient is a way of life.

Oh no sir, I didn’t say you were. Just as a generality.

[jsbhike]

I don’t remember that but I am aware of it, yes sir.

I mean I am all for Gadsden Flags and Snek Flags and all but I don’t think people really want actual anarchy because people would be killing each other left and right.

I mean, forming drunken posses seems fun at first and I wont say some people don’t have it coming.

That said, after a while it can get petty. I mean, people need their due process and day in court.

Well that is the statist claimed scare tactic version of anarchy, then there is the version of anarchy(that scares statists) where if something is important enough to become law there are no exemptions.

[OH58D]

Oh no sir, I didn’t say you were. Just as a generality.

I didn't think you were. Take this incident on a public street and move it to a citizen's front yard. Some undesirable has decided to take up residence in your front yard and refuses to leave. You call LE and they try to coax and cajole this critter into leaving. He refuses. Based on previous comments, the less confrontational approach would be to just let the undesirable remain and back off since the crimes are only trespassing and refusing a lawful order. Or they could escalate and in the ensuing violent encounter, the undesirable pulls a gun and shoots. The other alternative would be to let poor Mr. and Mrs. Citizen deal with the problem.

The absence of proactive LE is what allowed that St. Louis situation with the McCloskeys and their armed stand to take place.

[Firefly]

Well that is the statist claimed scare tactic version of anarchy, then there is the version of anarchy(that scares statists) where if something is important enough to become law there are no exemptions.

I’m not a statist. I would love a harem, mail order full auto, and no taxes.

That said, you miss the boat I think. At one time we just had Ten Commandments and you see how well that worked out.

I mean we need some kind of structure here.

[jsbhike]

I’m not a statist. I would love a harem, mail order full auto, and no taxes.

That said, you miss the boat I think. At one time we just had Ten Commandments and you see how well that worked out.

I mean we need some kind of structure here.

Structure is great and the rule of law would provide that very effectively. When a law gets put on the books there should be no exemption for executives, legislators, judges, police, and so on. Since members of those groups want to get involved, they shouldn't want exemptions and, in fact, should want increased penalties when members of those classes violate those laws.

As it stands now, those protected classes have no interests in individual liberties since their anointed status grants them privileges far beyond any rights.

[mrbieler]

Threads like this are proof that email, texting, and forums are a shit way to communicate and I would venture most folks are closer in opinion then it seems at times.

Watching the video, we all knew how it would end because we read the title. Going into it, you're angry. This ****ing sucks. Some shit stain killed an officer. I hope he fries and rather quickly.

But I'm watching it a 2nd and 3rd time and that's where I wanted to ask why did it get that far, how often does this it get stupid like this, and what other options are there. Officers get hands on. Again, I think it sucks for all involved, but law enforcement is often very unattractive. But I have to question are there other options during interactions like this and so many of the other ones we're watching.

This guy was being a dick. As much as I wanted to bitch slap him, being a dick is a relatively minor offense. Is a beat down where this needs to go? Up until the taser shot, it's failure, and when it got physical, if you didn't know what was going to happen at the end, was there really anything there that warranted going hands on? I don't think that's an unfair question.

That's why I brought up the idea of calling the wrecker and stopping the conversation. He's being an asshat. Don't engage with asshats. Tell the guy we're done talking, call the tow truck. Supervise the tow truck hook up, and if the guy still won't cooperate/get out, have it booted instead. Tow truck driver goes away to wait for his next call and the officer write the guys the tickets/summons. Loser gets to walk home or call a friend. If at some point, the moron does get out and tries to intervene, well now we DO have something beyond a license and registration violation. Things may very well and most likely should get ugly at that point.

We just had a more recent video where a black family in a rideshare watched the father get proned out and beat in the street. He was the passenger in a vehicle with a broken tail light. Driver didn't have ID. Officer demanded the passenger show ID and get out of the car. Passenger questioned the officer, why he the passenger, was being involved. Guy got out and then we have his beat down to watch. Why did any of that have to get physical?

Good shoots are good shoots. Sometimes a beat down is the answer. Pain compliance is a very useful in an officers arsenal.

As much as I would like to go to bed knowing it was all justified, we all know that's not true, never was true, and never will be true. And because of that questions get asked.

[Firefly]

Threads like this are proof that email, texting, and forums are a shit way to communicate and I would venture most folks are closer in opinion then it seems at times.

Watching the video, we all knew how it would end because we read the title. Going into it, you're angry. This ****ing sucks. Some shit stain killed an officer. I hope he fries and rather quickly.

But I'm watching it a 2nd and 3rd time and that's where I wanted to ask why did it get that far, how often does this it get stupid like this, and what other options are there. Officers get hands on. Again, I think it sucks for all involved, but law enforcement is often very unattractive. But I have to question are there other options during interactions like this and so many of the other ones we're watching.

This guy was being a dick. As much as I wanted to bitch slap him, being a dick is a relatively minor offense. Is a beat down where this needs to go? Up until the taser shot, it's failure, and when it got physical, if you didn't know what was going to happen at the end, was there really anything there that warranted going hands on? I don't think that's an unfair question.

That's why I brought up the idea of calling the wrecker and stopping the conversation. He's being an asshat. Don't engage with asshats. Tell the guy we're done talking, call the tow truck. Supervise the tow truck hook up, and if the guy still won't cooperate/get out, have it booted instead. Tow truck driver goes away to wait for his next call and the officer write the guys the tickets/summons. Loser gets to walk home or call a friend. If at some point, the moron does get out and tries to intervene, well now we DO have something beyond a license and registration violation. Things may very well and most likely should get ugly at that point.

We just had a more recent video where a black family in a rideshare watched the father get proned out and beat in the street. He was the passenger in a vehicle with a broken tail light. Driver didn't have ID. Officer demanded the passenger show ID and get out of the car. Passenger questioned the officer, why he the passenger, was being involved. Guy got out and then we have his beat down to watch. Why did any of that have to get physical?

Good shoots are good shoots. Sometimes a beat down is the answer. Pain compliance is a very useful in an officers arsenal.

As much as I would like to go to bed knowing it was all justified, we all know that's not true, never was true, and never will be true. And because of that questions get asked.

When you word it that way, whether or not it is intentional, you make it seem like the officers are at fault.

I mean, if he’s willing to gun down two armed men; why so you think he will magically go “Oh? Tow truck is here? Aw jeez, I guess I better get out so he can do his job then”.

What so you do if he decides to kill them over the boot?

That’s just unrealistic. You make it seem like State law is more of a suggestion than anything people are actually accountable to.

This is like me saying “Hey, your neighbors are blasting their music and having a good time. Why not just wear ear plugs so we don’t have any problems?”

This is like saying the Falklands were just some rocks and Pearl Harbor was a world away.

I mean, do you go through life that way?

[pag23]

https://malkoffdevices.com/collectio...nd-accessories. I haven't ordered the maglite upgrade yet but I do have the 6p led upgrade in an old surefire that started life as a incandescent rated for 100 lumens great for looking around a vehicle or large room without a lot of glare

Thanks for the link!