How Long Will Covid Restrictions Remain In Place...?

[Arik]

Granted I haven't been auditing hospitals, but they sold us that line during the height of the pandemic in New York and it turned out the hospitals were practically empty. Remember all the makeshift hospitals they built and the hospital ships offshore, that didn't see one single patient?

Here locally they reported a few weeks ago that the covid ward of the hospital only had one bed left. Turns out the hospital only had 10 covid beds, and 1 was empty. In a giant hospital with like 5 thousand patients, they only had 9 covid patients in the whole place.

A few weeks ago our hospitals were largely empty too. So what. That was a few weeks ago!

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[PracticalRifleman]

I don't know man, but it's going to take a lot to convince me at this point. Way too many shenanigans at this point.

ETA: I also know that an average night in the ER could be pretty crazy even before Covid. And I know that lots of hospitals have been making staff cuts.

I’ve never seen it like this after years and years in healthcare, never night after night and day after day with the ER filled and dozens waiting to be triaged.

Any shenanigans, real or perceived, doesn’t change what we are experiencing. Convincing you doesn’t change the reality of it. It’s not as if the half a dozen of us here telling you what we see are on the payroll of some manipulative kingpin perpetrating a grand conspiracy to convince you.


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[THCDDM4]

I’ve never seen it like this after years and years in healthcare, never night after night and day after day with the ER filled and dozens waiting to be triaged.

Any shenanigans, real or perceived, doesn’t change what we are experiencing. Convincing you doesn’t change the reality of it. It’s not as if the half a dozen of us here telling you what we see are on the payroll of some manipulative kingpin perpetrating a grand conspiracy to convince you.


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Curious- what do you specifically believe the response and precautions be for COVID?

What do you believe we should do That would be effective at stopping what you are experiencing in the ER/hospital?

[PracticalRifleman]

Curious- what do you specifically believe the response and precautions be for COVID?

What do you believe we should do That would be effective at stopping what you are experiencing in the ER/hospital?

I covered that previously in the thread.


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[THCDDM4]

I covered that previously in the thread.


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Do you have a post# I can reference?

I’ll go reread all 53 pages to find it, but if you kNow the post number that would be kind of you to share.

Thanks!

[PracticalRifleman]

Do you have a post# I can reference?

I’ll go reread all 53 pages to find it, but if you kNow the post number that would be kind of you to share.

Thanks!

Man I don’t know it’s been a week or two


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[okie]

A crazy night in the ER doesn't fill them up for days on end with more waiting. It can be a busy night but those people are leaving in a few hours and new ones aren't in line waiting. Each sick person will stay at least a few days. They take up space. New ones patients are already waiting for a free space. Meanwhile there's the daily emergencies that happen all the time. Because there is no free beds and already a line waiting to take the next available bed there is no room for the typical emergency. If you have 20 beds and 400 people it doesn't matter if yo have 1 doctor or 1000 doctors.

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Like I said, it's going to take a lot to convince me at this point. I've been hearing about this sort of thing at hospitals now for many years in terms of bed shortages and craziness in the ERs, etc. To me, this is just acknowledging the preexisting flaws in our healthcare system to try and convince people it's something new. Flaws that have become much worse in the last few years thanks to the rapid socialization of medicine since the passing of Obamacare.

I also don't necessarily doubt that people are going to the hospitals with respiratory illness, and that that might be putting stress on an already stressed system. But I strongly suspect a lot of those people just have normal colds and flus and are being erroneously diagnosed with covid. Either because the tests are inaccurate or because the test results are being falsified to get federal funding, or both. I know this is happening for a fact. I know firsthand about four people in my city who went to get covid tests and left before they got tested because they got tired of waiting. All four of them got test results back in the mail, and all four tested positive. This is something I know for a fact firsthand, and there are thousands of such anecdotes all over, that are probably true.

Some have been publicly verified. For example, the man in my state who died in a motorcycle crash, who was found amongst the Covid dead in the data. His family saw covid listed on the death certificate and went public, as did many others. When caught red handed, the director in charge said, Well he tested positive and we don't know that covid didn't cause him to crash his motorcycle.

So amidst these kinds of shenanigans how can I possibly not be highly skeptical? Especially when a medical journal just published and then retracted a study basically coming to my own conclusion.

[ABNAK]

What should be more concerning as far as testing accuracy goes is not false positives, but instead false negatives.

[Arik]

Like I said, it's going to take a lot to convince me at this point. I've been hearing about this sort of thing at hospitals now for many years in terms of bed shortages and craziness in the ERs, etc. To me, this is just acknowledging the preexisting flaws in our healthcare system to try and convince people it's something new. Flaws that have become much worse in the last few years thanks to the rapid socialization of medicine since the passing of Obamacare.

I also don't necessarily doubt that people are going to the hospitals with respiratory illness, and that that might be putting stress on an already stressed system. But I strongly suspect a lot of those people just have normal colds and flus and are being erroneously diagnosed with covid. Either because the tests are inaccurate or because the test results are being falsified to get federal funding, or both. I know this is happening for a fact. I know firsthand about four people in my city who went to get covid tests and left before they got tested because they got tired of waiting. All four of them got test results back in the mail, and all four tested positive. This is something I know for a fact firsthand, and there are thousands of such anecdotes all over, that are probably true.

Some have been publicly verified. For example, the man in my state who died in a motorcycle crash, who was found amongst the Covid dead in the data. His family saw covid listed on the death certificate and went public, as did many others. When caught red handed, the director in charge said, Well he tested positive and we don't know that covid didn't cause him to crash his motorcycle.

So amidst these kinds of shenanigans how can I possibly not be highly skeptical? Especially when a medical journal just published and then retracted a study basically coming to my own conclusion.

People with normal cold and flu don't take up entire hospitals in entire counties to where typical 911 emergencies are sent elsewhere. Theyre given some cold meds and sent home. In fact covid patients are also sent home. It's only the sickest that stay. I know of 20 + people who've had coronavirus. Out of those 2 spent three weeks in the hospital. It wasn't respiratory illness, it was covid.

However, even if it was respiratory it still took 3 weeks to get over.

Yes hospitals have crazy days but they don't have crazy multi-weeks where more and more patients come in each day than leave. Doesn't matter if it's respiratory, vision or diarrhea. The fact remains that each day there are more coming in needing care then there are those leaving. Even in the bad flu season a few years ago hospitals were not overfilling all over the country. Two hospitals here have already said try not to get hurt and don't call 911 because youll probably be redirected somewhere far. If you cut your finger off its going to suck but you'll live. However, if there's a heart attack or appendicitis or some other serious emergency well then .....

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[THCDDM4]

Except we do know things such as staying 6 feet apart and reducing congestion do reduce transmission.

The question isn’t what works, like so many want to poke holes in, the question is “should we do it”?

When one says or insinuates such obviously wrong or dense statements, it doesn’t move the pendulum their direction.


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Continual screaming “false positives” and “fake cause of death” and all the rest of it doesn’t change the fact that the hospitals are being overwhelmed in many areas. You realize the media sensationalizes everything, right?

You’re not making an argument for liberty, you’re undermining it by ignoring what is happening. It turns of the masses which aren’t as passionate as you.

Most Americans are very independent, defiant, and value freedom. Most Americans have common sense and generally want to look out for their fellow man.

Being honest, present the truth (not the conspiracy theory) and let the chips fall where they may.

Saying something like “we won’t mandate anything, but there is no evidence cloth masks work to do much, but for anybody that wants to help stop the spread there is a box of surgical masks for you. Come to the county health department and we’ll fit-test and N95 for you”.

Explain that full ICUs means there is zero emergency capacity and you or your loved one may die if they need a ventilator if we cannot get this under control.

Or explain to China-Mart that closing the store at 2000 hrs means more people squeeze into the store in a smaller time frame.

Recommend people buy in bulk and make fewer trips to the store, etc.

Recommend going to a drive-in movie rather than an indoor theater, etc.

Tell people the truth and tell them how they can help. No mandates and when morons spew conspiracy crap (which is likely from Chinese and Russian trolls) people need to shut them down with facts.


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I’ve given those answers multiple times. You can read them if you wish to go back and look.

I approve of zero lockdowns and zero mandates.

I approve of zero forced business closures.

I approve of zero speeding of misinformation.

I approve of zero spreading of conspiracy theory.

What do I support? Presenting accurate and up to date information to the public and businesses.

I support encouraging the public at large to take distancing measures, sanitization measures, so on and so forth.

I support educating the public that when all the vents are taken up, we can’t perform surgery for your ruptured appendix, or stent Dad’s LAD, or for performing surgery on your niece after she’s hit by a drunk driver.

I support encouraging businesses to sanitize, encourage distancing, all the rest.

I support providing up to date and through mask information, which has been nothing but feel-good nonsense thus far.

I support encouraging eye-coverings, face shields, and offering test-fitting of N95s for the public.

I support private businesses, if they so choose, requiring whatever they see fit on their property.

If you want to wear a virtue-signally cloth mask, I don’t want to stop you. But I do want to be presented with the information that shows it is garbage.


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Man I don’t know it’s been a week or two


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Okay- read through all 53 pages to get your recommendations. Quoted above.

So- social distance 6’. Check.

Somehow provide proper fit testing And find enough N95 masks for 300 Million people Here in the US and 8 Billion people worldwide. Check.

Eye pro and face shields. Check.

Drive in movie theater. Check.

Slow down congestion. Check.

Sanitize and hand washing.


So tell me again how the above will stop the hospital ER’s from being overwhelmed?

Not enough N95 masks. Now way in hell can we fit test even close to enough people to make a dent. The second a mask is taken off another fit test is needed. Even professionals who fit test everyday get it wrong, a lot.

Drive in movie theaters are all but gone. Not that anyone is really going to movie theaters anyways.

Eye pro and face shields, not enough to go around. Too late to make a dent anyways.

At this point, none of that is possible On a scale to make a difference and none of it will stop the infection rate or overwhelmed hospitals.

I totally 100% agree on the being honest and having facts and educating people position you take and maintaining liberty- letting people choose.

It’s just, this is a virus and there are 8 billion people on the planet. Viruses do what they do.

So-

How long do we wear these paper masks that do very little?

How long do we keep businesses closed and cause massive economic damage to our nation?

How long do we cause damage to young childrenS immune systems who don’t have exposure to bacteria and viruses that strengthen their immune systems?

How long do we cause developmental damage to children?

How long do we cause psychological damage to children and adults alike with all the fear?

The best gift our ancestors gave us is our Genetics and immune systems, living through Countless Corona viruses, flus, plagues, etc.

Vaccines have done wonders for some things and that may be the case for the Rona as well, but that won’t stop nor turn back all of this other damage that’s happening and continues to happen.

I highly doubt the efficacy of these vaccines as being anywhere near 90% effective, or even 60% effective at this point or in the next 5 years time being that effective- not to mention the few years it will take to produce enough to vaccinate everyone, and not everyone will take it anyways.

The hospitals will continue to get overwhelmed. The genie is out of the bottle and Pandora is out of the box.

It’s pushed our population to be even more divided. Politicians are using it for power and control.

I do appreciate your point of view and insights as someone working in a hospital. I agree with a lot of what you’re saying.

The collateral damage from our response to COVID has outpaced the direct physical damage from COVID itself in my opinion.