Striker Vs. Hammer Fire

[MegademiC]

"Glock pistols aren't meant for games. They're duty guns." Yes they are, exceptional in that role and I wish the DOD had chosen Glock too. It's the competition crowd that like to enhance a Glock's strengths to the point they are no longer strengths. Every Glock I've ever seen fail in some way failed because the owner had modified it.

Yeah, plenty of guys doing well with stock glocks(or other striker guns). For practical shooting as long as its reasonable, the trigger doesn't really matter... its mostly preference.

[jesuvuah]

I have a Legion now(buddies gun) and it's far from amazing. The trigger is better than a standard 226 but it's still ass.



Different systems with different methods of deployment. Long guns don't benefit from living in a holster that protects the trigger. A manual safety/selector is a necessity on a long gun.



I have some time on revolvers, not a lot as they're grossly outdated and I have near zero interest in them. I'm aware that you CAN fire a revolver in SA. The intended use of a DA/SA revolver is to fire all rounds double action. Firing SA is not practical or efficient.

As for working the reset, yes, you made my point. Working the reset is something that should be done on any auto. The constant contact method is only half the solution. Your finger should never leave the trigger, but failing to remove the slack/takeup and break the shot from the "wall" will result in poor hits. Running the trigger it's full length of travel is not a sound technique on a striker fired gun, or a DA/SA when fired in SA.




You're still not getting it... Yes people are lazy and most can't shoot for shit. It is estimated that less than 1% of firearms owners ever seek any form of professional training. However, if we take two equally untrained individuals and give them pistols. Those with striker fired guns(Glocks) will spend less time learning the gun than those with a DA/SA and a decocker. Doubly, with said untrained users, the potential for holstering without decocking is very much a possibility. Such an issue is not possible with a striker fired. The difficulty with the DA trigger is also a problem for the untrained. Again, not an issue for the striker owners. If we look at the other side of the situation, the trained shooters. Those training with a striker gun will spend less time mastering the fundamentals, a consistent trigger pull every time, positive reset and no decocker or safety to worry about. All of this allows more time for honing more advanced skills than someone with a DA/SA gun.

There is no debate. A DA/SA gun takes more time to learn than a striker fired gun. New shooter, seasoned shooter, it makes no difference. More controls, more time required to learn. This is a very simple concept.

Reliabilty. Glock is the gold standard. I don't drink Coke or Pepsi.



Glock pistols aren't meant for games. They're duty guns.

So you are saying glocks are good guns. I agree.

Sigs, HK's, Beretta, and many others are also great guns

Having owned almost all of them (with glocks being my staple) they all have pros and cons.

Soli Deo Gloria

[Mysteryman]

"Glock pistols aren't meant for games. They're duty guns." Yes they are, exceptional in that role and I wish the DOD had chosen Glock too. It's the competition crowd that like to enhance a Glock's strengths to the point they are no longer strengths. Every Glock I've ever seen fail in some way failed because the owner had modified it.

It shocks me that I have to explain everything down to a child's level.. Glock pistols are NOT designed or marketed for precision/competition use. I never said they weren't adequate, capable, or excellent for such use. Complaining that Glocks don't do well for bullseye work is a misinformed opinion and demonstrates a lack of understanding the equipment in question. Like many, I shoot Glocks in competition and do quite well. However, I have no illusion that my Glock is Olympic level capable, nor do I care.

So you are saying glocks are good guns. I agree.

Sigs, HK's, Beretta, and many others are also great guns

Having owned almost all of them (with glocks being my staple) they all have pros and cons.

Soli Deo Gloria

Older SIG pistols are alright, HK makes decent stuff. When comparing all aspects side by side, Glock pistols(and other striker fired models) come out ahead of hammer fired guns. Not saying the others aren't decent, but they aren't better.

[Delta-3]

Reliabilty. Glock is the gold standard. I don't drink Coke or Pepsi.

You make it sound like you drink their Kool-Aid though.

[1168]

Have you considered that perhaps the answer is not as obvious and universal as you would like it to be? I mean, its obvious to me that a plain white truck is the best color, and I have objective reasons why, but it does not surprise me that others buy different colors.

It shocks me that I have to explain everything down to a child's level..

***SNIP***

When comparing all aspects side by side, Glock pistols(and other striker fired models) come out ahead of hammer fired guns.

“And other striker models”.... including ones with long double action pulls, due to the striker not being pre-cocked to any degree? What about ones in which the striker is fully cocked, leading to a SAO trigger?

Since “one single trigger pull to master” seems to be the foundation of your arguments, and the main one I disagree with the relevance of, how do you feel about Beretta C models, in which there is only one trigger pull, because the hammer lives at half-cock?

[Mysteryman]

You make it sound like you drink their Kool-Aid though.

I drink the kool aid of products that do their job and do them well. Can you name a make or model of pistol that has more going for it than a Glock?? I really don't care what people spend their money on, it's their choice. I see firearms as tools. I want the most appropriate and capable tool for the job. Don't care what it looks like, don't care who makes it(aside from Chinese garbage). I leave emotion out of the decision. I haven't found a gun yet that offers more advantages than a Glock. There are plenty of nicer looking guns, but that isn't a factor for me.

Have you considered that perhaps the answer is not as obvious and universal as you would like it to be? I mean, its obvious to me that a plain white truck is the best color, and I have objective reasons why, but it does not surprise me that others buy different colors.



“And other striker models”.... including ones with long double action pulls, due to the striker not being pre-cocked to any degree? What about ones in which the striker is fully cocked, leading to a SAO trigger?

Since “one single trigger pull to master” seems to be the foundation of your arguments, and the main one I disagree with the relevance of, how do you feel about Beretta C models, in which there is only one trigger pull, because the hammer lives at half-cock?

The answer from a purely technical and practical aspect is very clear. There's nothing out there that offers more advantages or positive attributes than a Glock. What I see most often is people selecting a firearm(pistols specifically) based on emotion. They like the "feel" or the look, or their friend told them to get xyz. Almost no one ever looks at what they need for the desired role for the gun. This is usually because they don't have a role in mind. They're buying toys not tools. Then they defend their choice as if their life depended on it(the decision, not the gun). This is the case with hammer fired guns. Outdated and outclassed by striker fired guns. The hammer guns are still capable, they're just not the best option on the whole.

The Beretta C models are fine. It's essentially a nicer DAO trigger system. I'm not a fan of SA striker fired guns. They offer a consistent trigger, usually no manual safety but fail to offer the level of drop safety that a DAO striker gun offers. What's sad is some SA striker guns have heavier triggers than a DAO striker like a Glock. For example, the SIG 320 has a 6.6-7.7 lbs trigger and it's SA.

[1986s4]

It shocks me that I have to explain everything down to a child's level.. Glock pistols are NOT designed or marketed for precision/competition use. I never said they weren't adequate, capable, or excellent for such use. Complaining that Glocks don't do well for bullseye work is a misinformed opinion and demonstrates a lack of understanding the equipment in question. Like many, I shoot Glocks in competition and do quite well. However, I have no illusion that my Glock is Olympic level capable, nor do I care.



Older SIG pistols are alright, HK makes decent stuff. When comparing all aspects side by side, Glock pistols(and other striker fired models) come out ahead of hammer fired guns. Not saying the others aren't decent, but they aren't better.

Dude, I am sadly long past childhood so I do understand the difference between taking a machine past it's design parameters and staying within the bounds of function. Most of the Glocks I see in competition do work because their owners understand this point too..

[Adrenaline_6]

You're still not getting it... Yes people are lazy and most can't shoot for shit. It is estimated that less than 1% of firearms owners ever seek any form of professional training. However, if we take two equally untrained individuals and give them pistols. Those with striker fired guns(Glocks) will spend less time learning the gun than those with a DA/SA and a decocker. Doubly, with said untrained users, the potential for holstering without decocking is very much a possibility. Such an issue is not possible with a striker fired. The difficulty with the DA trigger is also a problem for the untrained. Again, not an issue for the striker owners. If we look at the other side of the situation, the trained shooters. Those training with a striker gun will spend less time mastering the fundamentals, a consistent trigger pull every time, positive reset and no decocker or safety to worry about. All of this allows more time for honing more advanced skills than someone with a DA/SA gun.

There is no debate. A DA/SA gun takes more time to learn than a striker fired gun. New shooter, seasoned shooter, it makes no difference. More controls, more time required to learn. This is a very simple concept.

Reliabilty. Glock is the gold standard. I don't drink Coke or Pepsi.

Your statement shows your bias. You cannot see it because you are....well...biased. You purposely put "Glocks" in parenthesis next to striker fired guns. There are other choices out there. Just as good or better. You might not think so...but others do and you are not in control of what is and isn't and cannot provide data that proves it is better (cheaper isn't better).

Glock isn't the Gold standard for reliability. It is a standard. Admittedly a good one. Nothing against Glocks at all. But that standard at times, have been matched or beaten. So are those that accomplished this "Platinum standards" then?

What I don't get with most fan boys is that if you don't pick their stuff that works for them, they somehow cannot grasp the concept that something else cannot work equally as good or better for someone else. It's weird.

[Ron3]

Your statement shows your bias. You cannot see it because you are....well...biased.

What I don't get with most fan boys is that if you don't pick their stuff that works for them, they somehow cannot grasp the concept that something else cannot work equally as good or better for someone else. It's weird.

It is.

I guess fan boys want validation. Individual and group.

I wonder if those types of personalities are this way about everything? Sports, finance, politics, relationships?

[robbins290]

It is.

I guess fan boys want validation. Individual and group.

I wonder if those types of personalities are this way about everything? Sports, finance, politics, relationships?

Yes they are, Fanboys are just related to firearms. Try to tell a chevy fan you drive a Ford, Or a Ford fan you drive a Chevy. Same thing applies to everything. The same person that told me Glock sucks said that his jeep suv is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I have guns that work good for me, but I am not going to fight/argue they they should work everyone else.