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Thread: NEW SPR TROUBLE ON FIRST RANGE TRIP. UPDATE IN OP.

  1. #1
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    NEW SPR TROUBLE ON FIRST RANGE TRIP. UPDATE IN OP.

    Ok Gents- need help & advice.
    Had a 20" rifle built by a local 'smith back in March I think. Took it to range next day, slow fired 60 rounds to check function, hung up a couple times in chambering, but was ok otherwise. Rifle was put in safe until 4JAN21.
    You can find all the details of the rifle in the Custom forum under the title After 5 Years...the Precious.
    So, had first class Match Ammo, several different brands of mags, from 10,20 & 30 rounds..all mags have been vetted in two other rifles for years.
    Here is what happened. Upon first loading the first mag...failure to chamber, bolt lacked about 1/2 inch or so closing. Hit forward assist, closed bolt...CLICK. Took out the round, small indent on primer. This happened 3 times in a row.
    Took out the National Match bcg..cleaned it thoroughly, then rifle would fire. BCG felt very sluggish. Was a cold windy day, and at this point was lubed with Ballistol after cleaning the bcg.
    Several more FTF & FTF after this with several known mags & Match ammo from IMI & Black Hills.
    So, ruling out mags & ammo...Im think the bcg is the culprit, but dont know how or why. I cannot give out accuracy results yet, due to the windy conditions of the day and my frustration at the moment with the gun.
    So- advice & opinion needed here ,and thanks very much in advance.

    UPDATE 10FEB21:
    PROBLEM SOLVED.
    Installed a David Tubb 42 coil Chrome Silicon recoil spring in rifle.
    Hit the range this morning...rifle functions & runs now like a scalded ape. Did about 25 lock back tests on about 8 different type of mags..100%.
    Chambered & fed 100% with 150 rounds. Threw all brass into a ballcap size area at 4:30 using MEN193.
    Really tested the rifle as much as I could & am now satisfied that it was a weak, or simply not strong enough RS to run the bigger, heavier NM bcg. Recoil was brisk and snappy, chambering was very solid. So, I am happy now to move on to next step of accuracy testing- which I will report back on here whenever that happens.
    To ALL who helped & made suggestions & ideas..except that one asshole in Texas...THANK YOU so much.
    SHOUT OUT TO SOTAR-THANK YOU SIR!
    Only downside to the todays range trip is I broke the FP on my Gen 4 G19..thats my main carry/SD gun too. Praise God it happened on the range..less than 50 rounds in. Got others to use while new FP's come in.
    Last edited by Straight Shooter; 02-10-21 at 12:11.
    The obedient always think of themselves as virtuous rather than the cowards they really are.

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    Do you have a “go/no gauge” to check headspace?
    A true "Gun Guy" (or gal) should have familiarity and a modicum of proficiency with most all firearms platforms.

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    If the BCG feels sluggish it might be the new gas rings. I had to hand rack a new bolt a bunch to get it to finally work.

    Try a different BCG?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gaijin View Post
    Do you have a “go/no gauge” to check headspace?
    Quote Originally Posted by TomMcC View Post
    If the BCG feels sluggish it might be the new gas rings. I had to hand rack a new bolt a bunch to get it to finally work.

    Try a different BCG?
    No sir..no gauges. BUT..the rifle was professionally assembled & Mike at Criterion personally headspaced the bolt to the barrel, for what thats worth.

    TOM....could be, but Ive never felt an AR this sluggish. Im really concerened to NM bcg is gonna have to go, but Ill wait & see. So far, the rifle has under 100 rounds.
    The obedient always think of themselves as virtuous rather than the cowards they really are.

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    Definitely bring a known good BCG for trouble shooting next time.

    Check and lube the gas rings, keep a new BCG very well lubed for the first few hundred rounds.

    Check gas tube alignment.

    Check for hammer / carrier drag.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd.K View Post
    Definitely bring a known good BCG for trouble shooting next time.

    Check and lube the gas rings, keep a new BCG very well lubed for the first few hundred rounds.

    Check gas tube alignment.

    Check for hammer / carrier drag.
    Good info- how do I check for hammer/carrier drag?
    The obedient always think of themselves as virtuous rather than the cowards they really are.

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    While you haven't much to do, do this til you pass out:

    Regularly lube the bcg and charge / dry fire a zillion times. Make sure the small gas rings remain wet. Every 25-30 or so remove the bcg and check for wear of its externals and within the upper.

    With the lower, lightly lube the trigger assembly. Dry fire it a zillion times while either holding the hammer during movement or padding the rcvr where it would impact to prevent damage to the aluminum.

    Hopefully, sooner rather than later, you'll notice a difference. If you do, execute a grin and keep doing for about another 10 minutes on each assembly.

    The highest level of success can be achieved while doing this watching Bevis and Butthead or most any other funny cartoon.

    Huntsville I see.
    Last edited by bamashooter; 01-10-21 at 08:36.

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    Remove the bolt from the carrier. Put the carrier back in and then check for excess drag pulling it back over the hammer. If the hammer can’t cock back fully it drags hard on the carrier.

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    If I had an AR professionally assembled, I'd spend very little time trying to fix it myself. He built it, so he (or she) should find the problem.

    Since you should have at least one spare complete BCG, that's as far as I'd go with troubleshooting. If your spare BCG allows the rifle to run, then the problem will have been identified.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Shooter View Post
    Ok Gents- need help & advice.
    Had a 20" rifle built by a local 'smith back in March I think. Took it to range next day, slow fired 60 rounds to check function, hung up a couple times in chambering, but was ok otherwise. Rifle was put in safe until 4JAN21.

    Upon first loading the first mag...failure to chamber, bolt lacked about 1/2 inch or so closing. Hit forward assist, closed bolt...CLICK. Took out the round, small indent on primer. This happened 3 times in a row.

    Took out the National Match bcg..cleaned it thoroughly, then rifle would fire. BCG felt very sluggish. Was a cold windy day, and at this point was lubed with Ballistol after cleaning the bcg.

    Several more FTF & FTF after this with several known mags & Match ammo from IMI & Black Hills.

    So, ruling out mags & ammo...Im think the bcg is the culprit, but dont know how or why. I cannot give out accuracy results yet, due to the windy conditions of the day and my frustration at the moment with the gun.
    So- advice & opinion needed here ,and thanks very much in advance.
    By your post (and the other one) this is a Young "National Match BCG."

    You do know there is no United States military or industry standard for National Match anything for the M16 and AR-15, correct? You bought into Young's snake-oil marketing. Their web site even states their carriers are NOT mil-spec.

    Your other thread says you've got a BCM bolt in the carrier, so I'm going to assume (yes, I know about ass out of you-and-me) that something may be causing a sluggish interference-fit between your bolt and carrier. Does this have standard gas rings or a MacFarland coil? Is the bore of the bolt carrier under-sized? Is your parkerized bolt tail polished to fit the carrier bore hole? Did you lube it well? Did you break it in (parkerized bolt finish against chrome carrier bore)?

    Does the gas tube bind on the gas carrier key on closing?

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