Canadian P320 incident

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

I went off on kind of a tangent but just trying to get gun forum readers to realize that our decades of experience with a Glock does not compare to a shooter/evaluator who only has boot camp/police academy level of firearms experience. David

Excellent point

[signal4l]

The 320 is the spawn of the 250--a gun so bad the US Air Marshall's threatened to sue Sig.

My department had a 20 year history with Sig. We carried the classic 226 and 220 pistols. Our last batch was equipped with the SRT trigger system. The safety lever would bind inside the trigger bar. A large percentage of our 40 caliber pistols had triggers that would not reliably reset. Working with Sig customer service to get this resolved was an absolute nightmare. We switched to Glocks.

SiG has some impressive manufacturing capacity and a willingness to innovate. I give them credit for being an American company and for supplying weapons to our military. They need to stop using their customers as beta testers. I can't think of one new SIG design that hasn't had problems.

The ongoing problems with the 320 are uncceptable and make me question the inherent safety of the design

[Slater]

Haven't heard a lot regarding the military M17/M18 versions. There was a bulletin last year covering a potential issue:

https://www.psmagazine.army.mil/News...ting-sluggish/

[WillBrink]

I have no doubt that they will eventually work this out. And it’s true that Beretta had issues in the early 80s that were pretty quickly resolved. Glock actually had quite a few problems over time but they have fixed all those too. I just don’t see why they adopted this beta model gun that doesn’t do anything special. I guess it was probably just money but I have suspicions. Especially how the selection sort of came out of the blue right as the Trump admin came in. I suspect guys from the old guard had made a deal but when trump won they had to rush the deal to make sure various retirement packages were secured. Just me being paranoid.

A Q I often ask. It seems even orgs -which are after all run by humans - want latest greatest gear vs "boring" vetted stuff. I'm not a beta tester of tech, and actively avoid first/early gen of tech, especially those that my life may depend on. if it's several gens in, and gets good feedback from the SME/BTDT types, I get interested, not until then.

[Todd.K]

Why are some trying to conflate an ND while holstering with drop safety issues?

[Sam]

Why are some trying to conflate an ND while holstering with drop safety issues?

Because haters will be hatin'. Anything to bring down the Sig and raise the austrian perfection back to its rightful throne.

I've had all kinds of glocks, the ones I shot the most were the 19, 17 and 34. I've shot them ok, but I had to focus on them and not switch to other platforms. The better the trigger (i.e. good trigger job), the better I shot. Back in the day when there weren't any aftermarket drop in trigger, I had this local guy work on my 34 and 17 triggers. He lightened and smoothed them. I shot those guns in IDPA and practice, but I never carried either one as the triggers were way too light for street carry. Imagine a 3 lb single action gun with no manual safety, that's pretty much what I had. I made master class in IDPA and even shot a passing score in one afternoon at the Rogers Shooting School with the 34.

I did ok with the stock trigger on the 19, but couldn't shoot master on the IDPA classifier with it, only managed expert scores.

When the M&P full size came out, I tried it and liked it. I never went back to the glocks. My M&P does not have any trigger work, all stock trigger. I've shot drills side by side with it and the g19 and my M&P scores were always better.

A few years ago I picked up a used, stock 320. Shot enough of it, about 1000 rounds, to know that it shot and felt in my hand better than the g19 but not as good as the M&P. Side by side comparison, I rate the M&P first, 320 second and g19 third, in terms of shooting for scores. In self defense scenario, I would assume that if one is a proficient shooter, it doesn't matter which one you use.

What gun do I still have, and in multiple copy? the M&P.

I wouldn't trust any recruit out of boot camp with any striker fired gun.

[prdubi]

Bada boom

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[1986s4]

The 320 is the spawn of the 250--a gun so bad the US Air Marshall's threatened to sue Sig.

My department had a 20 year history with Sig. We carried the classic 226 and 220 pistols. Our last batch was equipped with the SRT trigger system. The safety lever would bind inside the trigger bar. A large percentage of our 40 caliber pistols had triggers that would not reliably reset. Working with Sig customer service to get this resolved was an absolute nightmare. We switched to Glocks.

SiG has some impressive manufacturing capacity and a willingness to innovate. I give them credit for being an American company and for supplying weapons to our military. They need to stop using their customers as beta testers. I can't think of one new SIG design that hasn't had problems.

The ongoing problems with the 320 are uncceptable and make me question the inherent safety of the design

It's not a new design per say but my SIG P-210 American has been flawless since 2019. Appears and feels well built, accurate and the "American" modifications to the safety and mag button are well done.

[jesuvuah]

I both like, and dislike the p320

This latest Canadian issue sounds like it really has nothing to do with the gun, but how it was used, unlike some previous issues

I will share my 320 story. I shot glocks exclusively for a decade. I was good with them, but not what I would call great. I am no operator, but I grew up with guns and know how to shoot them. I finally decided to try something else when I got sick of the fact that I cannot fit an insulated gloved finger into the glock trigger guard, and it's cold where I live half the year. This eventually led me to trying out the 320.

I quickly fell in love. The ergos fit me much better. I could shoot better with less effort. I really liked the modularity of the gun. The caliber xchange kits are worthless to me because at their cost, I would just buy a second gun. The ability to change grip modules was great, and I eventually landed on the Wilson combat grip and loved it.

The more I used it and became familiar with it though, the more I questioned it as a ccw gun. With its fully cocked striker and lack of even a trigger safety, I came to the conclusion that, while I wouldn't call it unsafe, it opens the door to accidents that other tools don't.

I might reconsider them in the future with an m18, but I don't love manual safeties either.

Soli Deo Gloria

[1168]

Haven't heard a lot regarding the military M17/M18 versions. There was a bulletin last year covering a potential issue:

https://www.psmagazine.army.mil/News...ting-sluggish/

My (Reserve) company got a dozen of them 2 or 3 months ago.

Straight out of the box one is deadlined due to a safety issue found by a Soldier during a functions check. Armorer said some component appears assembled incorrectly, and somehow allows the trigger to function on safe, but only while OOB.

Also, on my M17, the slide moves while dry-firing, as if it is going to go OOB, then snaps back forward like a mm when the trigger breaks. Again, straight out of the box. Not very confidence inspiring.

I have very mixed feelings about these. Good news is, I’m probably less likely to need it than my EDC, and qual scores will prolly go up.