Question for soldiers: why doesn't the .mil let you carry a personal pistol?

[CRAMBONE]

Well, it was a cool-guy unit, but not like our own C17 a la NSW cool-guy unit.

Who was man? I’m confused.

[utahjeepr]

As per usual, I'm guessing this order DOESN'T apply to General officers?

Patton could get away with it. He could probably have gotten away with shooting anyone who gave him shit about it. It's a small club that can thumb their nose at the rules. I can guarantee if Patton had seen a jr officer or enlisted man doing the exact same thing they'd have been F'd.

[MountainRaven]

No...no infantry experience. I do have experience dragging heavy gear up hill on my back and a handgun was never something that broke the Camel's back.

I don't see how a pistol takes up that much space that it takes up the space of something useful. It's not like ....damn I could have grabbed 12 extra AR mags but didn't have room due to this pistol.

I understand how useless a pistol is in a rifle fight. Right up until your rifle is out of ammo. Then a handgun becomes pretty good idea. Does it happen often? Probably not but there were a few times it has happened

The two-ish pounds that your 15-shot Glock 19 weighs is the equivalent weight (approximately) of two M16 magazines loaded with 60 rounds of 5.56. Why on earth would you ever prefer to have 15-rounds of 9mm in a Glock 19 than 60 rounds of 5.56 for your M16/M4?

As per usual, I'm guessing this order DOESN'T apply to General officers?

https://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/med...ce641ae7939827

At the time Patton received his commission, it was normal for officers to supply their own sidearms. That's when he bought his pair of nickel-plated, ivory-stocked 45-caliber Colt model Ps. When he gifted one of those revolvers, he replaced it with a Smith & Wesson Registered Magnum (pre-model 27 N-frame in 357 Magnum). He was also far from the only GO - or officer of any rank commissioned or otherwise - in WWII to have supplied his own sidearm. Officers who chose sidearms with non-standard ammunition or non-standard parts were responsible for acquiring their own ammunition and, when necessary, paying for parts to repair their sidearms (most officers never shot their personally owned weapons enough to wear them out, so it was mostly a moot point - but both were reasons for officers to acquire quality sidearms and generally to acquire sidearms in the calibers used by the Army*).

I don't know when it ceased to be the norm for American officers to purchase their own sidearms, but I seem to recall that it was sometime around WWII. Even if it were prior to WWII, I imagine anyone complaining to Patton's bosses (Bradley, Ike, FDR, Truman, &c.) would have been very politely thanked for bringing it to their attention and then promptly demoted to private and transferred to the furthest outpost from them for wasting their time when there're Nazis/fascists/Japanese to kill (I imagine similar attitudes prevailed throughout the officer and NCO corps about other officers or NCOs or other ranks carrying personally owned weapons).

*While not the US Army, Winston Churchill carried a Mauser C96 as an officer in the British Army, both a very non-standard sidearm for the job and a non-standard caliber for the British Army. Colt M1911s and other pistols, including the Webley-Fosbery auto-revolver, were available for purchase by British officers through the Army-Navy Cooperative Society Ltd - which was far from the only method by which an officer could acquire their arms. Until recently, officers in the Swiss military could purchase their sidearms upon being commissioned - in addition to being able to purchase their issued arms upon discharge from the armed services.

[Arik]

The two-ish pounds that your 15-shot Glock 19 weighs is the equivalent weight (approximately) of two M16 magazines loaded with 60 rounds of 5.56. Why on earth would you ever prefer to have 15-rounds of 9mm in a Glock 19 than 60 rounds of 5.56 for your M16/M4?



At the time Patton received his commission, it was normal for officers to supply their own sidearms. That's when he bought his pair of nickel-plated, ivory-stocked 45-caliber Colt model Ps. When he gifted one of those revolvers, he replaced it with a Smith & Wesson Registered Magnum (pre-model 27 N-frame in 357 Magnum). He was also far from the only GO - or officer of any rank commissioned or otherwise - in WWII to have supplied his own sidearm. Officers who chose sidearms with non-standard ammunition or non-standard parts were responsible for acquiring their own ammunition and, when necessary, paying for parts to repair their sidearms (most officers never shot their personally owned weapons enough to wear them out, so it was mostly a moot point - but both were reasons for officers to acquire quality sidearms and generally to acquire sidearms in the calibers used by the Army*).

I don't know when it ceased to be the norm for American officers to purchase their own sidearms, but I seem to recall that it was sometime around WWII. Even if it were prior to WWII, I imagine anyone complaining to Patton's bosses (Bradley, Ike, FDR, Truman, &c.) would have been very politely thanked for bringing it to their attention and then promptly demoted to private and transferred to the furthest outpost from them for wasting their time when there're Nazis/fascists/Japanese to kill (I imagine similar attitudes prevailed throughout the officer and NCO corps about other officers or NCOs or other ranks carrying personally owned weapons).

*While not the US Army, Winston Churchill carried a Mauser C96 as an officer in the British Army, both a very non-standard sidearm for the job and a non-standard caliber for the British Army. Colt M1911s and other pistols, including the Webley-Fosbery auto-revolver, were available for purchase by British officers through the Army-Navy Cooperative Society Ltd - which was far from the only method by which an officer could acquire their arms. Until recently, officers in the Swiss military could purchase their sidearms upon being commissioned - in addition to being able to purchase their issued arms upon discharge from the armed services.

Because I don't see it as one or the other

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[Uni-Vibe]

Guy I knew that was a LERP in Vietnam said his outfit carried all kinds of weapons. He carried a Ww2 grease gun and a PPK. There was an M14, a shotgun, a couple AKs, Colt CAR 15, etc. I suppose snake eaters could carry whatever.

[AndyLate]

Guy I knew that was a LERP in Vietnam said his outfit carried all kinds of weapons. He carried a Ww2 grease gun and a PPK. There was an M14, a shotgun, a couple AKs, Colt CAR 15, etc. I suppose snake eaters could carry whatever.

Tankers were issued "WWII" Greaseguns until the M4 came along.

[Devildawg2531]

When I was in the Marines during some of our field exercises I would carry a concealed personally owned Glock. I know a few other Marines in my unit who often carried concealed as well. In some of our training we would be convoying in and lots of M16's but no one had live ammo. A lot of force on force training was with blanks and BFA's. I always thought man like 3 armed bad guys / terrorists could take this whole convoy and all the weapons and we are unarmed except for our personal knives. I never had any issue having a Glock with me but also didn't take it out or tell many. In hindsight I imagine I'd have been fried if carrying had been seen and escalated to command. At the time I thought carrying was prudent and not a big deal.

[AndyLate]

When I was in the Marines during some of our field exercises I would carry a concealed personally owned Glock. I know a few other Marines in my unit who often carried concealed as well. In some of our training we would be convoying in and lots of M16's but no one had live ammo. A lot of force on force training was with blanks and BFA's. I always thought man like 3 armed bad guys / terrorists could take this whole convoy and all the weapons and we are unarmed except for our personal knives. I never had any issue having a Glock with me but also didn't take it out or tell many. In hindsight I imagine I'd have been fried if carrying had been seen and escalated to command. At the time I thought carrying was prudent and not a big deal.

That would be ill advised in 90% of the Active Army units.

Andy

[Devildawg2531]

That would be ill advised in 90% of the Active Army units.

Andy

I imagine it was ill advised in the Marines in the 90's. We were doing some training at Fort McClellan and they had a pistol range in the middle of nowhere. We were doing nothing waiting for the next training schedule. We discussed with each other using their pistol range as no one was around.. but didn't and in hindsight glad we made that choice. Could have gone sideways quickly.

[chuckman]

Who was man? I’m confused.

Bleh. Sorry, I see my comment totally didn't make sense. I know some NSW units had their own ride in a C17 and did zip with customs. I also know DEVGRU, CAG, and ISA usually exempt from things mortals have to suffer. I didn't have that luxury for sure.

I imagine it was ill advised in the Marines in the 90's. We were doing some training at Fort McClellan and they had a pistol range in the middle of nowhere. We were doing nothing waiting for the next training schedule. We discussed with each other using their pistol range as no one was around.. but didn't and in hindsight glad we made that choice. Could have gone sideways quickly.

Man, I have seen NCIS called for a lot less.