Ammunition: Who is making the $? Who is price gouging?

[Leonidas24]

Academy 9mm prices averaging around 33 cents per round and as low as 20 cents per round
https://www.academy.com/shop/browse/...229mm+Luger%22

and

Midway 9mm prices averaging over 70 cents per round (for crap training ammo)

https://www.midwayusa.com/ammunition...D1%26Ntt%3D9mm

How come Academy can keep their prices close to normal? Hmmmm....

I've been shopping at Academy for most of my ammo needs for the better part of the last two years. When Frontier and Federal 5.56 were both holding steady at 6.49/box I was buying around 10-15 boxes per pay period. Since this time last year prices have slowly crept up to between 9.99-10.99/box, and there's now a line every Wednesday and Friday morning to score whatever the truck delivered that morning. Comparatively speaking, .50 cents per round is far more affordable than the $0.70-1.00 that most online retailers are asking, but it comes at the expense of showing up an hour before the doors open on days when I'm normally at work. And on top of that, every Wednesday and Friday whatever was delivered for consumer purchase at Academy is then put up on Armslist for double what was originally paid. THAT is price gouging.

On the other hand Rainier Arms is local to me, and their member price for PMC .223 is $11.49/box. That's pricey to me, but if it keeps me from digging into my 5.56 stash of higher quality ammo then I don't have a problem buying 3 boxes or so to at least get some drills in every 2 weeks. Their 9mm is right around $30 a box last time I checked, and I haven't bought any of that since it went up that high. But, they have it on the shelf the 6 days a week they're open and it's available for those who are willing to pay the price, and I don't consider them to be gouging either.

[Allen]

Scheels had alu cased blazer 9mm for $20 the other week. We've been printing a ton & raw materials are getting more expensive:
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/copper
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/lead
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/crude-oil
https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/natural-gas

Tie that in with the remington BK, Covid related staffing issues and you have limited production, a ton of new shooters, and yeah, prices go up. They'll come back down eventually as Vista gets Rem online.

[The_War_Wagon]

Ammunition: Who is making the $? Who is price gouging?

While I have just read the usual trite answers here. Duh! The raw materials have not increased that much.

Don't bet on it.

Copper breaches $9,000 a tonne in bet on economic bounce and supply limits


Industrial metal hits its highest level in a decade as global demand increases



A copper refinery in Russia.

Production is failing to keep pace with demand in China and the rest of the world, where consumption is rapidly picking up Copper production is failing to keep pace with demand in China and the rest of the world, where consumption is rapidly picking up.

Copper, the world’s most important industrial metal, climbed above $9,000 a tonne for the first time since 2011 on Monday, fuelled by speculative bets on higher prices from China. The number of copper futures contracts outstanding on the Shanghai Futures Exchange has jumped sharply since the end of the lunar new year holiday, according to brokerage Marex Spectron.

After rising 8.1 per cent on Thursday and 6 per cent on Friday, open interest in those copper futures expanded a further 6 per cent on Monday to 365,000 contracts, as investors bet on further gains for the metal, used in everything from household goods to wind turbines.

Marex reckons the net speculative long position on the Shanghai exchange — the difference between bets on rising and falling prices — is more than 100,000 lots and close to the highest level since 2017. “It has been an exchange-led, speculative move but there are good reasons for it,” said Mark Hansen, chief executive of Concord Resources, a London-based commodity trader.

In early trading on Monday, copper rose as much as 4 per cent to $9,269 a tonne before pulling back to $9,060. The metal is already up 15 per cent this year, a performance that has boosted the stock prices of leading producers including Glencore, Freeport-McMoRan and Antofagasta.

Keep in mind, brass is ALSO made from copper.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

When was Sandy Hook, 2013? It’s been difficult to find .22 ever since that occurred and what you stated above seemed to be the only answer for it. Well, that was 8 years ago, I’m guessing it would have paid off for Federal etc. to purchase more machinery and hire people to operate it.

I remember being in Africa and listening to a BBC radio program about the skyrocketing price of rice. The reporter went through every step of the process down to the farmer, no one admitted making any more money.

For the past few years, I haven't had issues with 22. 5 cents a round was my price point but for the Semi-auto (40gr HV) that works well for me, I'd go 7-8cents. Shipping became the issue. I was just about to pull the trigger on a couple cases of 22 right before this all hit. I had been holding off looking for some local to try out before I went with the lower-lead ammo, but lost out. I generally waited for a good price or no shipping from Palmetto and by a bunch of boxes of Winchester Semi-Auto Match ammo.

I have about 20 different brands of odds and ends. I'll take them to the range and make it drill failure day...

While I have just read the usual trite answers here. Duh! The raw materials have not increased that much. Just because there is "temporarily" greater demand you do not "have to" raise the price especially in a panic that will harm the consumers. The business strategy to triple prices because there is greater demand (for a VERY temporary demand spike) with the strategy to reinvest profits as to increase manufacturing capability is a great way to going out of business. People are NOT going to be spending all of their spare cash on ammo forever, so that would be a fools errand. I believe this IS PRICE GOUGING! The local big box sporting goods store here Academy is keeping their ammo at the original price points and they are not doing that to get people to come in and buy tennis racquets and running shorts it is just their policy and VERY patriotic and ethical policy. I just think we should be finding out who is price gouging and letting them know we will remember them and be rewarding those who did not. IMHO... YMMV.

What good is list price ammo if you have to show up at 6am on every other Wednesday and know the handshake? At least with 'price gouging' there is ammo to be bought. COVID and delivery are not really issues anymore. I'm in manufacturing and most places are up and running and the supply chain, domestically is pretty good- overseas, not so much.

If everyone just bought what they needed, like some magical place like Pottersville when people only took out of the bank what they needed, then there wouldn't be an issue. But as soon as it gets tight, people panic buy, it dries up and now everything siezes up. Consumers are to blame for 'price gouging' as anyone. THe people that buy what ammo they can get, and then parse it out in sandwich baggies at +$1 per round online.

I agree that the reason we end up like this, and I mentioned it in my post, that adding capacity to the manufacturing is not a great place to put capital. At the very least though, I'd be replacing old equipement that causes issues. I disagree about how 'short' this will be. We are a year in and maybe we start to see some softening. Maybe after they try a gun grab and it doesn't stick, that would help. Some good SCOTUS rulings would really be a way to reduce everyone's stress level.

Good news is this afternoon I cleaned up the gun room and found about 1000 rounds of 22 in bags I had forgotten about. Box here, box there, it adds up.

I think that the real way to tamp down the 'gouging' would be to let people pre-order ammo. They say that they know how much that they are going to make. Let people auction for the ammo going out 6-12 months. That way there is some vision as to how long people will be willing to pay high prices. Make people pay now so that they don't just place orders.

[GH41]

While I have just read the usual trite answers here. Duh! The raw materials have not increased that much. Just because there is "temporarily" greater demand you do not "have to" raise the price especially in a panic that will harm the consumers. The business strategy to triple prices because there is greater demand (for a VERY temporary demand spike) with the strategy to reinvest profits as to increase manufacturing capability is a great way to going out of business. People are NOT going to be spending all of their spare cash on ammo forever, so that would be a fools errand. I believe this IS PRICE GOUGING! The local big box sporting goods store here Academy is keeping their ammo at the original price points and they are not doing that to get people to come in and buy tennis racquets and running shorts it is just their policy and VERY patriotic and ethical policy. I just think we should be finding out who is price gouging and letting them know we will remember them and be rewarding those who did not. IMHO... YMMV.

It's not that complicated... If you think the sellers are gouging you don't buy from them. Do without! Nobody owes you reasonably priced ammunition.

[Arik]

Academy 9mm prices averaging around 33 cents per round and as low as 20 cents per round
https://www.academy.com/shop/browse/...229mm+Luger%22

and

Midway 9mm prices averaging over 70 cents per round (for crap training ammo)

https://www.midwayusa.com/ammunition...D1%26Ntt%3D9mm

How come Academy can keep their prices close to normal? Hmmmm....

They take a slight lose knowing you'll buy something else too. Notice they don't ship? I live in a densely populated are. About 7 million people and the nearest Academy for me is over 250 miles. (Bass Pro and Cabela's are an hour and half via toll turnpike. Between gas and toll it isn't worth it because they typically get killed on price) Meaning I can't buy unless I drive over and if I do I may as well look around and buy something else while I'm there. It's the Costco rotisserie chicken. (if you don't know what I'm talking about look it up)

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[Arik]

I believe this IS PRICE GOUGING!

I believe the stay puffed marshmallow man is real. Doesn't make it so

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[SteyrAUG]

Does anyone know who is responsible for these prices?

Consumers. Supply<Demand.

If you don't have enough ammo, that's mostly your fault. It's been coming for awhile, there is lots of precedent. If you haven't been building since 2008 don't complain now. A little over a year ago ammo was plentiful and cheap.

[duece71]

As said above.....supply and demand. People think the end of the world is coming. Hysteria is everywhere.

[morbidbattlecry]

My question is where is it all going? I'm hearing companies are putting out record amounts, but it seams like it's just getting dumped into a black hole or something. I remember sandy hook, and ammo was actually available but just at ridiculous prices. Now it's just gone.