good non tacticial branded 223 remington self defense loads

[vicious_cb]

I'm not sure how a weapon reduced in size based on a 1920's design qualifies as "more modern", the AR-10 was designed in the late '50's.

Who cares. He lives in socialist Europe, take what you can get at that point.

[iceman0085]

@Eda I have done some further research and there would be m193 type Military ammo available from a Ammo Company called ggg in Lithuania for a quite a good not sure though if the terminal peformance is similar to the m193 use made rounds. If they are idenctical they would be decent short range self defense round.

But to on the absolute safe side it would be better to use expanding type ammo. Concerning that the choice is rather good. I could get the federal Fusion, the federal power shock Standard soft Point, some Winchester PowerPoint and the european stuff from PPU, Standard gecco soft Point and RWS sofpoints. Norma ammo would be available too. Norma is out of the question though. No Standard soft Point or hp rounds just specialised Hunting rounds. Too expensive for my liking and also Maybe not the best choice for sd either.

[Eda]

The federal fusion is the best choice, it is bonded and will perform well from the 18.5 inch barrel of the mini 14. The others are non bonded but will still perform well. I wouldn't recommend m193 for defense, but for an absolute last choice it should perform well enough. GGG is some of the best military ammo I've ever tested, it is very clean burning and accurate. The GGG ss109/m855 available in the us is the most accurate ss109 load I have ever tested. GGG is very high quality ammo, it is great practice ammo or for stockpiling

[vicious_cb]

@Eda I have done some further research and there would be m193 type Military ammo available from a Ammo Company called ggg in Lithuania for a quite a good not sure though if the terminal peformance is similar to the m193 use made rounds. If they are idenctical they would be decent short range self defense round.

But to on the absolute safe side it would be better to use expanding type ammo. Concerning that the choice is rather good. I could get the federal Fusion, the federal power shock Standard soft Point, some Winchester PowerPoint and the european stuff from PPU, Standard gecco soft Point and RWS sofpoints. Norma ammo would be available too. Norma is out of the question though. No Standard soft Point or hp rounds just specialised Hunting rounds. Too expensive for my liking and also Maybe not the best choice for sd either.

The only real expanding bullet you listed is the Federal Fusion. Unless the Winchester load says Ranger, its not bonded. The others ones will just end up fragmenting.

[Eda]

The only real expanding bullet you listed is the Federal Fusion. Unless the Winchester load says Ranger, its not bonded. The others ones will just end up fragmenting.

The winchester and federal should expand and retain 60-65% of their weight, even of of the long barrel. They all penetrate pretty well, and I'd definitely considerer them as an ok backup to the fusion

[Eda]

@Eda I have done some further research and there would be m193 type Military ammo available from a Ammo Company called ggg in Lithuania for a quite a good not sure though if the terminal peformance is similar to the m193 use made rounds. If they are idenctical they would be decent short range self defense round.

But to on the absolute safe side it would be better to use expanding type ammo. Concerning that the choice is rather good. I could get the federal Fusion, the federal power shock Standard soft Point, some Winchester PowerPoint and the european stuff from PPU, Standard gecco soft Point and RWS sofpoints. Norma ammo would be available too. Norma is out of the question though. No Standard soft Point or hp rounds just specialised Hunting rounds. Too expensive for my liking and also Maybe not the best choice for sd either.

I would avoid the Geco and RWS softpoints. They are too light and fragile. As far as I know geco soft point is only 3.4 gram and RWS is 3.6 gram. They will very likely under penetrate, especially from the longer barrel of the mini 14. Try to stick to bullets of 4 gram or larger (62grains). If you are interested in heavier OTM style bullets RWS target elite plus is loaded with 5 gram (77grain) bullets. Altho they do seem to be loaded a little slow(2575 fps), and are rather pricey.

[Todd.K]

The federal fusion is the best choice, it is bonded and will perform well from the 18.5 inch barrel of the mini 14. The others are non bonded but will still perform well.

Fusion / GoldDot also has a very small, protected, soft point that feeds well in most semiautomatic rifles.

Regular soft points above 60gr are not terrible but marginal to poor if barriers are involved. 55gr and below get into very shallow penetration ranges and are better used against squirrels.

[iceman0085]

Thanks a lot for the further in Formation. Then I will stick to the heavier loads with bonded bullet if financially feasible.

@Eda Yes you are absolutely right the RWS loads have Pretty light bullet. The match load would be interesting though but it seems to be loaded not that hot.

I will check out if there are other 77 otm loadings available that are laoded a bit hotter. Maybe i find some.

which Mk262 round would be the best in general?

[Eda]

Thanks a lot for the further in Formation. Then I will stick to the heavier loads with bonded bullet if financially feasible.

@Eda Yes you are absolutely right the RWS loads have Pretty light bullet. The match load would be interesting though but it seems to be loaded not that hot.

I will check out if there are other 77 otm loadings available that are laoded a bit hotter. Maybe i find some.

which Mk262 round would be the best in general?

Best is black hills, then IMI, the magtech(now discontinued). I'm not sure how available any of those are for you, and they are moderately expensive, and may be even more expensive in Europe. The 62gr Federal fusion is a better and more consistent performer, and it's cheaper. Many people like 77gr OTMs, but I personally don't. They're rather inconsistent, sometimes they don't fragment at all make make an icepick wound, causing "over penetration", and more importantly, poor incapacitation

[iceman0085]

Thanks for the info. Then the OTM are similar to the m193 or m855. If they yawn and Fragment they are very devastating but they didn't behave like that in the target they are not nearly as effective as bonded soft Point round. Will stick to the federal Fusion or the Standard soft Point variants from Winchester and Federal in the 60 to 69 grain range then.

I asked around and maybe it would be possible to get the black hills offerings but it would be hasle logistically and Money wise as well. So the OTM would be the best choice anway from a logistical point of view.


I also found a critical defense load in 73 grain Hornady. They are on the more expensive side though. Have not read anything About the hornady critical defense rifle rounds though. So I cannot say if they are good or bad.

Does someone in the Forum has experience with this load?