Opinions on Winchester Ranger-T ammo?

[ABNAK]

Specifically the 9mm flavor.

I have read and seen pics of tests with the 127gr +P+ version and it's expansion was inconsistent and not reliable round-to-round. The 147gr version appears to not be afflicted by that and is more dependable in that regard. They are basically modern equivalents (namely the black boxed ones, which are newer than the tan boxes) of the 90's era "Black Talon", which although it gained an anti-gunner reputation it really wasn't that good of a round performance-wise. Obviously bullet technology has advanced over the years and the Ranger-T is the result for Winchester.

I'm an HST guy myself, with the 147gr load being my choice for CCW or home defense. Have a fair amount of too. That said, I have a couple hundred rounds of the 147gr Ranger-T's (black box) and was wondering what you guys thought of it for two-legged critters.

[CRAMBONE]

Is it a bonded? And I can’t remember if that one is on Doc’s list or not.

[Defaultmp3]

Ranger T is not bonded. As I recall, it performs fine as long as there's not much by way of barriers; if there are intermediate barriers, it suffers compare to its bonded counterpart, but since it is on DocGKR's list, I would think it still is acceptable for carry for the most part (HST isn't bonded either, after all).

[CoryCop25]

The older ammo in the tan boxes had two types, bonded and not bonded. I still have a few left. I have had good results with the Ranger-T ammo, accuracy and reliability wise.

[ABNAK]

I like his tests, so have a look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UP7p3fxgzE

[Straight Shooter]

I carried that and shot and chronoed a bunch of it a few years back...as I clearly recalled LAV saying it was his preferred carry load, at the time anyway.
Wasn't much extra recoil, was accurate, but then a lot of tests started poppin up saying it acted almost like an FMJ, or little expansion if any.

[Ron3]

I've only tested them in mud (127 gr), which I've found has surprisingly similar results to gelatin tests. (Not penetration, just expansion)

The "typical" result is partial expansion. Two or half of the petals open up partially or mostly. But sometimes they all open though more commonly none do.

Doesn't make them bad, really, just be aware they are very inconsistent. There are many Police Depts that use them. I assume they beat others out on price.

[voiceofreason]

The talons introduced "cutting" as a mechanism into the wounding process instead of just crushing.

I'm a fan of HST but would carry Ranger T with no issues. +p+ and 127 aren't my thing

147 standard HST is easier to shoot, easier on gun, better through intermediates

just find a load you can always get more of and is 200 rds+ reliable in your specific gun

[Straight Shooter]

Thought Id throw some chrono info up for yall, in case anyone cares. Winchester Ranger 127 +P+.
G17..10 round average:1268fps with 18fps SD.
G19...10 round average 1236 with 18fps SD.
Accuracy was excellent out to 25 yards I tested. Recoil was not at all much more noticeable.

[ABNAK]

Thought Id throw some chrono info up for yall, in case anyone cares.
G17..10 round average:1268fps with 18fps SD.
G19...10 round average 1236 with 18fps SD.
Accuracy was excellent out to 25 yards I tested. Recoil was not at all much more noticeable.

You're talking about the 127gr +P+ right? Those can't be 147gr numbers.

I've watched a few videos testing the 147gr Ranger T's out of different barrel lengths. I personally didn't have much luck with the 127gr +P+ when I tested it, but apparently others have had issues with that load also as far as reliable expansion is concerned. Most 147gr loads, no matter what manufacturer, seem to have more leeway for barrel length changes than lighter 9mm loads; this carries across calibers (heavy-for-caliber rounds have less velocity loss when going to shorter barrels) as a general rule. However, from the couple of videos I saw it appears that the Ranger T 147gr also suffers from that performance deficit when fired from shorter barrels. Keep in mind that the velocity loss in a subsonic is not much when shot from a 4" or a 3" barrel. It appears that the Ranger T's are susceptible to even a little loss of speed. Just throwing these numbers out there from memory, but a 4" will yield ~ 950fps while a 3" (or 3.1", I don't remember exactly) was running at about 920fps or thereabouts. The expansion difference in the same test with different barrel lengths in gel was considerable, given the minor reduction in velocity. Therefore I will keep the 147gr Ranger T's for guns with 4" tubes (or the Scorpion with a 7.75" barrel) and HST 147gr for the more compact CCW pistols. HST 147's have consistently performed well in my own test as well as other videos I've seen no matter the barrel length.

Bottom line? I think the Ranger T's are designed to perform in a very tight window of velocity; HST seems to be more flexible.