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Thread: Is .45 Obsolete (Mas Ayoob)?

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by indianalex01 View Post
    Ayoob is a band wagon jumper. Always has been. One min he was all about 45 and then 9mm and then back to 45. Chuck Taylor exposed him years ago. Chuck Taylor has always been a 45 guy. He also is the one that put 350,000 rounds through 1 Glock 17 that is now on display at Glock.
    May I ask where/when chuck Taylor "exposed" Ayoob? Would like to read that if possible.
    " Be NOT ye afraid of them..
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  2. #52
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    So is it more important that the first shot landed crush more tissue?

    Or that you have more shots available to shoot that crush less tissue?

  3. #53
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    Is the 45acp obsolete, is a silly question, of course it isn't obsolete too many guns in the hands of American gun owners.

    Is the 45acp, better than a 9mm, I don't think so based on my life experience.

    If we were faced with 10 round limits, then make mine either 9mm or .357 sig.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by voiceofreason View Post
    So is it more important that the first shot landed crush more tissue?

    Or that you have more shots available to shoot that crush less tissue?
    The question isnt which one causes more tissue damage.. That's easy, the 45 does. The question is does that extra tissue damage actually make a big difference in stopping a fight? The consensus has been "not really"

    Solid hits on organs and major blood vessels can cause very rapid blood loss, loss of blood pressure, and unconsciousness. A slightly wider bullet nicking an artery or organ can definitely cause someone to bleed to death, but it's unlikely to be a fight stopper.

    The reason why more ammo and lower recoil are sought after is that it gives more more opportunities and faster follow up shots to land GOOD hits in those vital structures inside the body.
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    Mass will say that everyone should carry single shot 22shorts if you pay him enough. His spreading bs that you shouldnít carry sd rounds you handloaded was my first turn off from him. His lies for money have been repeated ad nauseam across the web for decades. Is the 45 irrelevant? No. Is mass becoming irrelevant? Yes and has been for awhile.

    Heís ever only been able to cite one case of being charged with murder from using hand loads. And it was a guy who shot someone in their bedroom, and the revolver was loaded with different rounds, because he was supposedly going out to test them. So they couldnít determine the distances because none were the same. Itís the only case that itís been an issue, of thousands and thousands of self defense cases. That one is the only one where itís pointed to that Iíve seen.


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  6. #56
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    I like the idea of a lighter weight, inexpensive, (180-200 gr) .45 flat-nosed bullet.

    A 200 gr bullet at 900 fps is pretty pleasant to shoot It will cut a good hole and penetrate well. Bullets that miss and strike buildings or cars down range will be less likely to penetrate than a faster bullet.

    I don't think it's a bad choice in this age of expensive ammo and shortage of premium bullets.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron3 View Post
    I like the idea of a lighter weight, inexpensive, (180-200 gr) .45 flat-nosed bullet.

    A 200 gr bullet at 900 fps is pretty pleasant to shoot It will cut a good hole and penetrate well. Bullets that miss and strike buildings or cars down range will be less likely to penetrate than a faster bullet.

    I don't think it's a bad choice in this age of expensive ammo and shortage of premium bullets.
    200 gr semi flat-nose going 830 fps is what i use in my 1911 for anything, bad guys, practise, etc. Been using it for decades.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by wil View Post
    200 gr semi flat-nose going 830 fps is what i use in my 1911 for anything, bad guys, practise, etc. Been using it for decades.
    Jacketed or lead?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron3 View Post
    Jacketed or lead?
    lead, non jacket.

    Way back when I figured worst-case no ammo situation owing to government decree, economic collapse, what-have-you.
    I could cast my own out of wheel weights & plumbers solder if that's what I had to do.

    That & the cast lead worked fine as well as being lower cost to purchase. I also figured it being basically the same as jacketed ball ammo minus the jacket, what's the difference in it's killing ability? Semi-flat nose probably would not just punch through, it'd tend to smash it's way through as did the minie bullet.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by wil View Post
    lead, non jacket.

    Way back when I figured worst-case no ammo situation owing to government decree, economic collapse, what-have-you.
    I could cast my own out of wheel weights & plumbers solder if that's what I had to do.

    That & the cast lead worked fine as well as being lower cost to purchase. I also figured it being basically the same as jacketed ball ammo minus the jacket, what's the difference in it's killing ability? Semi-flat nose probably would not just punch through, it'd tend to smash it's way through as did the minie bullet.
    Makes sense to me. I haven't had any trouble with it from my 2.0 M&P.

    I agree there are pro's and con's to an under 1100 fps lead vs jacketed pistol bullet. (Terminally and otherwise)

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