Ivermectin obliterates 97% of Delhi cases

[HKGuns]

Here is a video that was censored from YouTube on the benefits of Ivermectin as well as the absolute failure of State Sponsored Medicine.

[pinzgauer]

The entire spike protein may not be needed for the immune response, so just a portion may be made by the vaccine. That doesn’t make it unquestionably harmless either, just look up how mad cow disease works if you want to see an extreme example of how proteins alone can do damage.

Respectfully, it's very clear you guys have no idea how vaccines operate.

The vaccine does not create a spike protein.

Instead, it looks enough like the real covid 19 virus such that your body produces the correct antibodies (white blood cells, tea killer cells, etc) to attack that virus. It mimics enough of the RNA to trigger the immune response.

The same immune response that would have been triggered if you got covid and recovered from it.

Those antibodies may also have spike proteins to bond with the virus, but the vaccine did not create it, it just tricked your body into creating the correct antibody. Which for that virus needed a spike protein.

Beyond that I don't know the details, perhaps the RNA to mimic a virus has to have spikes and such. It does have to look enough like a virus fragment that your natural antibodies detect it and trigger the response.

But it doesn't take a complete virus cell to trigger the response, it can be just a fragment of the RNA as long as it's the right fragment that your body can recognize.

I have fragments of shingles virus RNA in my cornea which my body thinks is a live virus and continues to attack it even though the shingles virus is long dead. My body is sending white blood cells and such, which creates an issue with my vision.

This from a serious shingles attack 18 months ago. To which my ophthalmologist pointed out the people that are speculating on how long immune response will last should pay attention to this type of thing.

When you have to get a new vaccine It's normally not because your body lost its immune response, instead it's because the virus mutated over the year enough that the old immune response does not work anymore. Viruses that don't mutate much or at all can be lifetime, those that mutate a lot like flu virus, can drift over a year.

[SomeOtherGuy]

Todd K - you may be right about the fragment/portion of the spike protein, I don't know. I have seen references indicating that the current vaccines cause your cells to make the whole spike protein, as it was apparently thought early on to be a relatively harmless part of the virus and easy to make your immune cells recognize and attack. Other references, like the CDC site below, indicate it's a "harmless" fragment of it. The Salk Institute article indicates that the whole spike protein is a major source of medical harm, and with the assumption that the vaccines result in your cells making only part of that protein, it's still unclear if that part is safe.

https://www.salk.edu/news-release/th...le-in-illness/

Respectfully, it's very clear you guys have no idea how vaccines operate.

The vaccine does not create a spike protein.

The CDC says it does:

COVID-19 mRNA vaccines give instructions for our cells to make a harmless piece of what is called the “spike protein.” The spike protein is found on the surface of the virus that causes COVID-19.

Main source: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ines/mrna.html

Instead, it looks enough like the real covid 19 virus such that your body produces the correct antibodies (white blood cells, tea killer cells, etc) to attack that virus. It mimics enough of the RNA to trigger the immune response.

The same immune response that would have been triggered if you got covid and recovered from it.

You are describing the mechanism for conventional vaccines, which are used for most previously serious illnesses and childhood killers; polio, MMR, DTAP type vaccines.

mRNA vaccines use RNA to directly make some of your cells do something. Viral vector vaccines use DNA encased in a harmless virus to do the same thing. They are programming your cells directly as the first step, and any immune response is a later step. Conventional vaccines have immune response as the first step.

Those antibodies may also have spike proteins to bond with the virus, but the vaccine did not create it, it just tricked your body into creating the correct antibody. Which for that virus needed a spike protein.

Beyond that I don't know the details, perhaps the RNA to mimic a virus has to have spikes and such. It does have to look enough like a virus fragment that your natural antibodies detect it and trigger the response.

But it doesn't take a complete virus cell to trigger the response, it can be just a fragment of the RNA as long as it's the right fragment that your body can recognize.

Again, all the Covid-19 vaccines currently offered in the US cause your cells to make the spike protein or some portion of it using either messenger RNA (Pfizer, Moderna), or DNA (J&J). So for these three vaccines, the vaccine did in fact directly cause the spike protein (or fragment) to be made.

FYI viruses are not considered cells.

[pinzgauer]

I'm not a biologist/virologist so most of this is beyond me. My understanding is that our body does not use RNA, That's a virus thing. We have DNA.

I'll have to take a read of the CDC stuff, It sounds interesting.

But my understanding is that even with the messenger RNA all it's doing is tricking your body into thinking there's an invader, and thus triggering / training the white blood cells and tea killer cells.

And specifically it has not introduced DNA that is causing your body to reproduce those rna fragments.

Which is what triggered all the speculation on nasal effectiveness. (And thus would it kill a virus you were carrying from breathing in even if it had not gotten to your lungs) The conjecture was that a vaccine given in the arm would not trigger a significant immune response in the nasal cavities.

This was found to be absolutely not the case, which they should have known because when your body is attacked the white blood cells and tea killer cells circulate through your circulatory system and thus cover your entire body.

What makes them cluster is when they bond / latch on to the target bacteria or virus. My understanding is that's when the spikes and the hooks come into play. The way I've read it described is as like a velcro, not literally but the cellular/biological equivalent. The spikes / hooks bond with the target cell, etc

Back on topic, it's kind of bizarre how an anti-parasite drug like ivermectin which is normally used to kill parasitic worms, mites, etcetera has impact on covet. Sometimes all it takes is a slight change in the body's chemistry and things can't reproduce, so it'll be interesting to see what they find about ivermectin.

Very clearly they've done double-blind medical studies that show that it does inhibit reproduction of covid.

I don't think it's a magic bullet, and Ivermectin has its own side effects. It is not something I would want to take unless I absolutely had to. Though we give it to puppies and kittens all the time.

I now have an extended family member (brother's sister-in-law), felt she was at low risk and that it was just another case of the flu who now got covid along with her parents. She has been to the emergency room twice with extremely low oxygen levels, and her dad is in ICU flipped over on his belly trying to get fluids out. He likely will not make it.

Early 40s, runner / hiker with no comorbidities. Thought it was all a scam and just another flavor of the flu, her kids had it, no big deal. So she didn't get vaccinated.

Husband had to fly to Montana to drive her home when she got well enough to travel.

So if ivermectin helps, maybe that will help with the people who choose not to get vaccinated. Covid is not going away

[AndyLate]

I now have an extended family member (brother's sister-in-law), felt she was at low risk and that it was just another case of the flu who now got covid along with her parents. She has been to the emergency room twice with extremely low oxygen levels, and her dad is in ICU flipped over on his belly trying to get fluids out. He likely will not make it.

Early 40s, runner / hiker with no comorbidities. Thought it was all a scam and just another flavor of the flu, her kids had it, no big deal. So she didn't get vaccinated.

Husband had to fly to Montana to drive her home when she got well enough to travel.

So if ivermectin helps, maybe that will help with the people who choose not to get vaccinated. Covid is not going away

No offense, but your extended family member's experience is far outside the pale. She is at extremely low risk of severe Covid complications if she was in her 40s and reasonably healthy.

Its nearly an urban legend - I cannot count on the fingers of one hand how many times I heard/seen someone relate how a Covid doubter (always under 60) caught Covid and either died or narrowly escaped death due to herculean effort by hospital staff. Perhaps your distant relative tempted fate by saying "Fauchi" three times in front of a mirror.

I (50s) am vaccinated because I don't want to deal with getting particularly sick, not because wicked Covid is hiding around the corner waiting to strike me dead.

It is not a secret that mortality for people under 65 who test positive for Covid is incredibly low and pushing the vaccine based on 24 deaths out of 100,000 people is not going to be effective. Pushing the vaccine because you will be sick as a dog is more effective. Ask anyone who had Covid - it sucks.

Covid death rates by age in the UK (because I question the CDC's data to be honest): https://www.gov.uk/government/public...england-report

Andy

[pinzgauer]

This is probably not the thread for it, but mortality rates versus getting very sick are two different things. And she is very sick.

It's pretty clear that there's people who are complete deniers.

Then there's a group that thinks it's real but only hits old people or those who should die anyway because they're overweight or diabetic or have ingrown toenails.

And then there's the people that think it's like ebola.

I'm kind of in the middle. Late 50s early 60s like many of us, I got vaccinated as soon as I could. College age, most of them already had it, and I don't know if it made sense to vaccinate them or younger.

One thing is very clear to me and many others: It's not just the flu and people die from it who did not have anything near fatal that would have killed them other than the normal statistical stuff that comes with age. (Cancer, Etc)

We don't know the long-term effects even on young people. There is some evidence of decreased lung capacity that they are starting to find. And I have a nephew who almost a year later is just now getting a sense of taste back. And went through a very bad period where the tastes were scrambled and all food tasted spoiled.

Now we can get back to discussing taking puppy anti-parasitics as a covid treatment

[AndyLate]

Now we can get back to discussing taking puppy anti-parasitics as a covid treatment

That one sentence speaks volumes.

[grnamin]

Why are they stomping on any treatments? Simple, law/regulation specifically prohibits the use of emergency certification of a vaccine if there are safe and effective treatments. If they acknowledge ivermectin or anything else as a treatment then the vaccines must go through the full FDA approval process.

If I was a little more tinfoily I might suggest that there was a political calculation regarding higher body counts making for a more effective political tool. But you know... that would just be cynical. I'm sure that no politico would really take advantage of people dying or anything.

Medical Industrial Complex, anyone?

[jsbhike]

That one sentence speaks volumes.

Big time.

It's like none of us have seen official statements from Brady: politicians of all varieties/ media/docs/scientists/pharma execs.

[pinzgauer]

That one sentence speaks volumes.

Apparently people are taking ivermectin for horses and having to be hospitalized.

Dosage is way off. If someone is going to try Ivermectin at least get the formulation and dosage for humans, it's also used as a wormer in humans.

Should be cheap enough, I've given it to horses, cattle, and dogs and cats has a wormer.

Will be interesting to see how it pans out, lots of folks claiming censorship and foot dragging