Israel retiring the Tavor in favor of the M4

[Aries144]

I have owned a FA Uzi SMG for almost 20 years. They are not at all difficult to control. Shooting open bolt SMGs is a different experience from anything closed bolt, but different doesn’t mean difficult.

Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that I was shocked that I found an M4 easier to control. The Uzi wasn't difficult, I just found I could more easily hold a smaller group at 25 yards with the M4, and that surprised me. I expected the Uzi to be easier to control.

For further comparison, I found the MP5 to be easier to control than the Uzi or the M4.

[SteyrAUG]

Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that I was shocked that I found an M4 easier to control. The Uzi wasn't difficult, I just found I could more easily hold a smaller group at 25 yards with the M4, and that surprised me. I expected the Uzi to be easier to control.

For further comparison, I found the MP5 to be easier to control than the Uzi or the M4.

The MP5 will almost always upstage the Uzi because it is familiar to most shooters. Open bolt guns have a different rhythm and it needs to be adapted to. I bet if you spent a month with an Uzi you would shoot it tighter than an M4 on full auto and close but not quite as tight as a MP5.

M-10s are the zippers that are tough to tame in their original config. But once people got Lage uppers and better stocks even M-10s started winning top spots at Knob Creek SMG shoots. There was one year there was only a single MP5 in the top 5 spots and I think everything else was Lage M-10s and maybe even one Sten or some crazy tube gun like that.

[Aries144]

I bet if you spent a month with an Uzi you would shoot it tighter than an M4 on full auto and close but not quite as tight as a MP5.

Challenge accepted. When do you want to meet up? I'll bring ammo.



I got to shoot an M11 in .380 one time. I was warned about the rate of fire and so tried to do small bursts. I think I got maybe three bursts before the mag was empty, ha! I also got to shoot either an M11 or M10 in 9mm with the Lage kit. I recall the Lage as being heavy, but very controllable.

[SteyrAUG]

Challenge accepted. When do you want to meet up? I'll bring ammo.



I got to shoot an M11 in .380 one time. I was warned about the rate of fire and so tried to do small bursts. I think I got maybe three bursts before the mag was empty, ha! I also got to shoot either an M11 or M10 in 9mm with the Lage kit. I recall the Lage as being heavy, but very controllable.

If ever you are in Iowa I'll gladly put you through SMG 101. And yeah, the M11 is an even faster zipper. Something insane like 1,200 rpms and it throws big S shape groups.

[HKGuns]

If ever you are in Iowa I'll gladly put you through SMG 101. And yeah, the M11 is an even faster zipper. Something insane like 1,200 rpms and it throws big S shape groups.

Thought you were in FL? When did you end up in IA?

[crusader377]

Back to the main question, does anyone know what variants of the M16/M4 the IDF is currently using. My understanding is the Israeli's always had a mix-match of rifles from the M16A1 and Colt 653s which were supplied as military aid from 1973 onwards to a variety of M16A2 style rifles from the 1980s and 1990s acquired through military aid to some newer M4s.

Also, is Israel purchasing new M4s or are they getting free ones through military aid programs?

Interestingly enough the previous Israeli assault rifle the Galil was also phased out in favor of M16 series rifles in the 1970s and 1980s.

[okie]

If ever you are in Iowa I'll gladly put you through SMG 101. And yeah, the M11 is an even faster zipper. Something insane like 1,200 rpms and it throws big S shape groups.

Well at least now we know where all the ammo is disappearing to!

[SteyrAUG]

Thought you were in FL? When did you end up in IA?

3 years ago.