PB,
I mean no disrespect, hopefully you haven’t taken anything that way. I’m speaking of magazine fed bolt guns, I.e. AIAT or AX that can be run inside of recoil impulse of a large frame gasser. 20 rnds opposite a 10 rnd mag, numerical advantage, yes.
Shoot ability past 500 yards and the gas gun advantage is gone, especially with misses and malfunctions. Large frame gas guns don’t do well long term with heat. Not my observation, but guys who have dealt with them. This thread alone exposed those weaknesses. I have an LMT MWS and it’s incredible, but I’ll not make it something it’s not.
Respectfully!
I'm not certain I've understood you correctly, so please forgive me if my reply doesn't make sense.
I can tell you that personally my ability to make multiple fast hits on targets with my large frame gasser is far faster than any 308 bolt gun I've ever run. For example, I've been able to make 50 hits on steel targets at known ranges from 300 to 750 yards in a little over 2 minutes (EDIT 2:29). Sometimes even sending subsequent rounds before the rapport from the previous round hitting steel comes back. I can't imagine that's even possible using a bolt gun. Magazine fed or not.
Furthermore, though I know I don't shoot my build nearly as much as PB and Mark shoot their LMTs, I've had zero malfunctions of any kind in the approximately 2k rounds of commercial ammo I've put through it. Small sample size, I admit, but enough to convince me that it's reliable.
EDIT: The time for the 50 hits was almost two and a half minutes.
Last edited by georgeib; 09-20-21 at 16:15.
Yea, I have and run 10 round mag fed bolt guns and go to work. I've even done it with my 300WM's. If you are shooting out past 700 yards then quick follow up shots are less critical. I think both have there place and why we have both. The big gasseer does did give super fast follow up which might be needed at shorter ranges and the notorious bolt guns can do sniper work best, in general terms I guess. Exceptions to every rule and I'm glad I have both and shoot both weekly.
George, 50 shots in 2:29 , fkn A Brother.
No offense taken from anyone, just good speak.
PB
"Air Force / Policeman / Fireman / Man of God / Friend of mine / R.I.P. Steve Lamy"
It wasn't nearly that impressive in reality. It was near the end of the day, and we have established our drops and there was no wind. This particular range (Gunsitehills) has steel targets ranging all the way out at known distances, so I had my reticle subtensions down pat at this point. Used my buddy's Magpul D-50 mag and did 10 rounds at each distance. As softly gassed as I've set my gas block, I'm sure it could have been done in under 2 by a better shooter.
Thank you for the responses, gentlemen! I’m just giving info from a much different perspective by men who much prefer the opposite and personal experience with malfunctioning equipment in bad places. Guess I’m playing devils advocate and I’m probably way out of line here, too. I’m just here to learn. I have both and shoot both, too, but I’ll do both very slowly…
I’ll add this, I’m well aware of the ability to make hits with gasser’s at 7-800 yard, 3 rounds 3 seconds, bolt gun ain’t gonna do that… I’m not capable of that skill level, but I’ve seen it done by more than one person…
I’m gonna shut up now so I can learn more.
Interesting the number of different perspectives and how different tools should be deployed. I love it!
I used to completely agree SFree. However, when you want to engage multiple targets, have a limited time for a target to be exposed, or simply want a quick follow up correcting off your last shot.... The gas gun blows the bolt gun away.
If you spot your shot, you can crack off a follow up shot faster than your spotter can articulate your prior shot. I am for sure a bolt gun lover, but when it's time to hurry up, a pretty accurate gasser blows away a really accurate bolt gun all day long.
"What would a $2,000 Geissele Super Duty do that a $500 PSA door buster on Black Friday couldn't do?" - Stopsign32v
markm,
I cringe to even bring this scenario up, but with your last comments gas guns would completely dominate PRS type competition, yet they’re not even close? And they’re timed events? I do realize the gist of the conversation is about “combat type” situations, I guess I’m really dense, but small frame gas gun can smoke a bolt gun in rapid fire, but I’ve not seen anyone yet outshoot an accomplished bolt gunner in competition.
Last edited by SFree; 09-20-21 at 21:36.
I’m done, but I will say, it would be a great honor to get instruction from you and PB in either discipline. I’m just an old hillbilly that shoots out behind the barn. Thank you for your kind response and not flaming me for my ignorance!
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