12.5 range

[CPM]

Honestly, it doesn’t matter. Any expanding rounds are about the same. Any AP round is about the same. 193/262 are about the same ballistically.

They all fly about the same at 200. Good luck explaining shooting though something to hit a subject at 200 yards. If you can find an officer willing to throw rounds through a barrier to hit a subject he can’t see at 200 yards he should be fired.

It’s not sexy, but it really is shot placement. I just witnessed a buddy of mine win a 10k run and gun with shots to 550 and 650 using 193 from a 12.5.

[themonk]

50-grain TSX

[tk390]

Honestly, it doesn’t matter. Any expanding rounds are about the same. Any AP round is about the same. 193/262 are about the same ballistically.

They all fly about the same at 200. Good luck explaining shooting though something to hit a subject at 200 yards. If you can find an officer willing to throw rounds through a barrier to hit a subject he can’t see at 200 yards he should be fired.

It’s not sexy, but it really is shot placement. I just witnessed a buddy of mine win a 10k run and gun with shots to 550 and 650 using 193 from a 12.5.

The question was not so much the concept of taking a shot at 200 yards, it was more for the knowledge of adequate performance at distance. Any ballistic test I have seen are at close range. I have see video of Jerry Miculek use a 9mm and hit target at 1000 yards. Neither answer what the effective range of the 9mm round. I know that with proper shot placement the effectiveness of the round is extended.
For the record I have covers an officers moment across a plowed cornfield from about 125 yards. would the TRU round been as effective at that distance as our CQB distances? My bet is no, but I also don’t have that data either


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[themonk]

The question was not so much the concept of taking a shot at 200 yards, it was more for the knowledge of adequate performance at distance. Any ballistic test I have seen are at close range. I have see video of Jerry Miculek use a 9mm and hit target at 1000 yards. Neither answer what the effective range of the 9mm round. I know that with proper shot placement the effectiveness of the round is extended.
For the record I have covers an officers moment across a plowed cornfield from about 125 yards. would the TRU round been as effective at that distance as our CQB distances? My bet is no, but I also don’t have that data either


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I agree with you on the lack of data. For that range you will need to be looking at military data and not LE.

[tk390]

I agree with you on the lack of data. For that range you will need to be looking at military data and not LE.

Thanks, where would I be able to find that type of data? Would the military have data on civilian ammo since it isn’t allowed or used?


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[themonk]

Thanks, where would I be able to find that type of data? Would the military have data on civilian ammo since it isn’t allowed or used?


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I asked everyone I know or met that have used them and observed their effects. Most say 50-grain TSX is a heart attack.

[ggammell]

The question was not so much the concept of taking a shot at 200 yards, it was more for the knowledge of adequate performance at distance. Any ballistic test I have seen are at close range. I have see video of Jerry Miculek use a 9mm and hit target at 1000 yards. Neither answer what the effective range of the 9mm round. I know that with proper shot placement the effectiveness of the round is extended.
For the record I have covers an officers moment across a plowed cornfield from about 125 yards. would the TRU round been as effective at that distance as our CQB distances? My bet is no, but I also don’t have that data either


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it’ll do damage but it fragments and there’s no telling how and where the the fragments go and how deep they penetrate. That’s really the whole flaw of that projectile.

[CPM]

You guys just aren’t being realistic with the expectation of predicting terminal effects. 5.56 inside of 300 is a damn disaster on a human being, with the exception being 855 to the torso, which is like a needle. You should be more concerned with your ability to hit a moving human being, who doesn’t want to be shot and who might be shooting back at you at those distances.

I’ve seen the same round hit people and do completely different things. Gel tests are a joke. Pick a round with a ballistic tip, aim at the top of the sternum and call it a day.

[ViniVidivici]

And keep putting hits on.

As a wise man has said, "it's not a 30 round magazine, it's 6 kills per mag".

[scooter22]

You guys just aren’t being realistic with the expectation of predicting terminal effects. 5.56 inside of 300 is a damn disaster on a human being, with the exception being 855 to the torso, which is like a needle. You should be more concerned with your ability to hit a moving human being, who doesn’t want to be shot and who might be shooting back at you at those distances.

I’ve seen the same round hit people and do completely different things. Gel tests are a joke. Pick a round with a ballistic tip, aim at the top of the sternum and call it a day.

Why do you specifically recommend a round with a ballistic tip?