IF you had to take the vaccine, which one should you take?

[jsbhike]

edit: Forgot to mention all the talk about faking covid positives to get hospitals paid is ridiculous. Just fantasy talk. My hospital is in dire straights from Covid. Shut down elective surgery, nursing shortage is real. Paying traveling nurses is expensive.

No idea why it was(or is) done, but she clearly states that's what they were doing.

https://week.com/2020/04/20/idph-dir...re-classified/

"Essentially, Dr. Ezike explained that anyone who passes away after testing positive for the virus is included in that category.

"If you were in hospice and had already been given a few weeks to live, and then you also were found to have COVID, that would be counted as a COVID death. It means technically even if you died of a clear alternate cause, but you had COVID at the same time, it's still listed as a COVID death. So, everyone who's listed as a COVID death doesn't mean that that was the cause of the death, but they had COVID at the time of the death." Dr. Ezike outlined."

And the FL ME trying to claim a big ball of covid attacked a motorcyclist causing a fatal crash.

https://www.newsweek.com/florida-man...h-data-1518994

[Troutrunner]

You're gonna have to explain that one to me. Especially since many if not most people now have some degree of natural immunity, which is demonstrated to be far superior in every way. I even know people who've gotten the vaccine and still got covid. Young healthy people. And not only did they get it, they got it bad, and then spread it to their unvaccinated family members, who ended up getting a lighter case and getting over it quicker.

On your second point, for how long??? And how long are the boosters going to work for? And after those fail, how long will they be able to make variant specific boosters before the virus is mutating too quickly to roll them out?

And none of that is even mentioning the outrageous VAERS data, the metric shit ton of people all over the place saying it ****ed them up, or all the complete unknowns, like what happens when the next variant comes out. This isn't people saying they got queasy after eating a fruit rollup, as you characterize it. There is real data to back it up in countries that are just a few months ahead of us on the timeline. These aren't fish stories or people making things up because they don't like vaccines. They're hurting people way worse than anything prior, and all for a virus that's hardly deadlier than the season flu. And again, we're only a few months in. What is this going to look like three years from now?

We don't know that "MOST" people have had the Rona. Current numbers are 266K positives, I agree that there are more due to barely having symptoms but how do we know? The point is, we don't. It's ok to not know, it's bad to claim that we know things when we don't. That's the fatal error, among others, that Fauci made. Never lie to the people. Just be honest about what you know and don't know.

2nd point - No argument that the vaccine decreases your chances of severe disease. Doesn't matter the one off stories people have. You have to deep dive each case, what are the comorbidities, other aspects of their health and what were the health factor for the others that did well. There is more to the virus related to genetics, race. etc, we don't know it all yet. The under the table slam is that the vaccine made them sicker, that's fantasy.

Boosters: Let's talk about what the vaccine does. It makes you make antibodies to fight the virus. These antibodies are circulating around and ready to get into the fight. When there is no fight we have a troop drawdown and they return to the barracks. Boosters call the troops back to the front as a show of force ready to fight at a moment's notice. This is beneficial for someone who is immunocompromised and need help and a jump on the enemy. Not everyone needs this help. If you are younger, healthy with none of the risk factors I don't see the need for the booster. When my body sees the enemy, I'll call up my boys and they will be deployed. Slower than if I was boosted, but I don't need the instant jump. Why aren't we arguing about the double dosing of all the other vaccines we get, MMR for example?

Agree that the monoclonal antibodies work, you get the boys dropped in for the fight in surge numbers. Bring it on!!

For the record the remdesivir and such are a coin toss. Kinda work but not on everyone and not all the time. Ivermectin is being appropriately studies but given what it is it most likely won't work. The initial studies were garbage. Hopefully, we get some clarification in the future like we did with hydrochloroquine.

Vaers: This is a self/hospital reporting mechanism, it cannot be taken as fact. It is reasonable to expect underreporting and over reporting at the same time. Truthfully, it is archaeic in design and this is where CDC/USA have dropped the ball. Yes, there are people who said the fruit roll up caused their stroke. I live the fantasy nightmares of people everyday, "No it's not the weed I smoke everyday making me throw up, it's because my landlord allowed cadmium in the drinking water from the city". Causation does not equal correlation. Happens everyday. Welcome to medicine in the 2000's. There is good info to have from VAERS but you have to get through all the static to find the problems. Problems like myocarditis and clots. These were weeded out from all the crazy talk from everyone thinking the fruit roll up caused their cancer. Do I think we'll find a few more issues with the vaccine, probably, we did with all the others but the issues were rare and the overall benefit of the vaccines to everyones risk was vastly superior to the rare negatives.

[prepare]

Due to all the flip flopping, inconsistency, suppression of information, banning health experts, lack of common sense approach we took our 99.9% chances. Started taking the supplement protocols, never wore the mask of shame, eventually got the C and it was no big deal.
Bottom line you cannot comply your way out of tyranny.

[Troutrunner]

Let us consider that this has been out there moving through the population for 18(?) months now.
How can you move about through the population, getting meds, groceries, gas all necassary for modern life and have not had some contact with Covid-19?
I believe I've had some contact with those who were infected and also have natural immunities, but, how do you prove such a thing?

You could get antibody testing. Easy.

I've been in the thick of it and never been tested and never thought I needed to. Again, the Rona does what the Rona does. Maybe my genetics are different, or my years of working in the filth has improved my immunity, or my vaccine is working, but I'm not sick. With Delta, I'm seeing younger people aged 20-50's. If it has your number, Rona comes calling.

[Troutrunner]

No idea why it was(or is) done, but she clearly states that's what they were doing.

https://week.com/2020/04/20/idph-dir...re-classified/

"Essentially, Dr. Ezike explained that anyone who passes away after testing positive for the virus is included in that category.

"If you were in hospice and had already been given a few weeks to live, and then you also were found to have COVID, that would be counted as a COVID death. It means technically even if you died of a clear alternate cause, but you had COVID at the same time, it's still listed as a COVID death. So, everyone who's listed as a COVID death doesn't mean that that was the cause of the death, but they had COVID at the time of the death." Dr. Ezike outlined."

And the FL ME trying to claim a big ball of covid attacked a motorcyclist causing a fatal crash.

https://www.newsweek.com/florida-man...h-data-1518994

I put that in the category I mentiond before. You must tell the people the truth. This kinda of stuff feeds the flames of conspiracy and doesn't help the cause. They should not have done that.

[Troutrunner]

Due to all the flip flopping, inconsistency, suppression of information, banning health experts, lack of common sense approach we took our 99.9% chances. Started taking the supplement protocols, never wore the mask of shame, eventually got the C and it was no big deal.
Bottom line you cannot comply your way out of tyranny.

My take is cloth masks are dumb. Surgical masks provide some protection and the N95 is great. Wearing a mask outside is dumb. In a closed workspace I can see the point. If you had active TB would it still be shameful to wear the mask. Maybe we should focus on what works and what doesn't instead of shaming people for having a mask or shaming people for not being vaccinated. This party works both ways. I'd rather we focus on the realities.

Wish there wasn't all the confusion but stomping my feet and pouting isn't any better. Looking at the reality of the situation is a good thing.

With all the confusion and inconsistencies in the alternative protocols vs vaccination, what was it that made you believe that information instead of the other information?

Why didn't you just rock Rona cold, shirtless, standing in the wind, smoking a cigarette?

[jsbhike]

My take is cloth masks are dumb. Surgical masks provide some protection and the N95 is great. Wearing a mask outside is dumb. In a closed workspace I can see the point. If you had active TB would it still be shameful to wear the mask. Maybe we should focus on what works and what doesn't instead of shaming people for having a mask or shaming people for not being vaccinated. This party works both ways. I'd rather we focus on the realities.

Wish there wasn't all the confusion but stomping my feet and pouting isn't any better. Looking at the reality of the situation is a good thing.

With all the confusion and inconsistencies in the alternative protocols vs vaccination, what was it that made you believe that information instead of the other information?

Why didn't you just rock Rona cold, shirtless, standing in the wind, smoking a cigarette?

I can see the N95 providing some protection against tb due to the particle size being larger than the N95 pore size, but viruses are smaller.

I have seen the 3M claims about N95 having microscopic fibers that somehow catch particles that are smaller than the pores, but that sounds a lot like the product literature that came with their double ended indoor/outdoor ear plugs that made almost magical claims about how well they worked that haven't stood up well to real world results.

[czgunner]

So, vaccines forever right? Its a virus its not going away. Its safe and we should just take them because somebody says so? Its nearly 100% survivable.

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[mRad]

There's some nuance to this...

If he comes into contact with a COVID+ person and sees his dad 15 mins later, you're right; chances are it's still in his nose and transmissible.

If he comes into contact with a COVID+ person and sees his dad a day later, chances are the particles in his nose will have been deactivated by then. And in this case the vaccine does reduce his chances of transmission because it reduces his chances of contracting COVID and becoming a carrier.

I’ve seen contradicting research on this. More of it leans toward, “no”.


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[mRad]

I've known 2 people who died from the vaccine. One older lady in my church didn't want it but her kids hounded her about it. The day after getting the vaccine, she passed out, rushed to the hospital and required several blood transfusions. Second lady, a nurse and healthy, in her 40's died of a massive heart attack a day after getting the shot.

This doesn’t make sense.

The vaccine made her bleed? Where? That is the OPPOSITE effect than many relate to it.

Second case should could have had a heart attack at any time. To link it to vaccination would require more that correlation. Where was the heart attack? What was the occlusion?

Your examples are like saying, “they drank water the morning of their death, therefore water killed them”. While I am against the mandate and don’t think the vaccine is all that, truth trumps fear. And what you’re telling requires further investigation. As it stands, it just muddies the waters.


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