Recomend me a rifle/caliber for Elk and Deer

[markm]

Get something with Ackley in the name!

[C-grunt]

I'm not much of a hunter but I work with a know many. Several friends locally have jumped on the 6.5 Creedmoor train for hunting. I think they are up around 10 elk killed with it now. I believe all (definitely most) have used the 143 ELD-X bullet. A couple of past 400 yards too. It's been very successful for these guys. All shot 270, 30-06, 7 mag, etc prior and all have great things to say for the 6.5.

[gunnerblue]

I’m totally unqualified to provide advice on shooting elk, but given the historic popularity of the 270, and the current popularity of 6.5 CM, I wonder why the 6.5-06 never caught on. Flat shooting, lotsa neck for long, high BC/SD bullets, or long copper 140s, reasonable but high powder capacity, nearly as much juice as 6.5 PRC, but not as much of a barrel burner as the similar magnum.

With lighter bullets, it would stomp pronghorns or whitetail at whatever range, much like the 25-06. Its basically between 25-06 and .270, but in a bore where heavy-for-caliber projectiles are common.

Never factory-loaded like the 25-06 or 270. 6.5 never really caught on until the 6.5 Creedmoor in the US.

[gunnerblue]

I'm not much of a hunter but I work with a know many. Several friends locally have jumped on the 6.5 Creedmoor train for hunting. I think they are up around 10 elk killed with it now. I believe all (definitely most) have used the 143 ELD-X bullet. A couple of past 400 yards too. It's been very successful for these guys. All shot 270, 30-06, 7 mag, etc prior and all have great things to say for the 6.5.

That would be on my short list for elk with a 6.5 Creed, along with the 129 Nosler Accubond Long Range and the 130 Barnes- great sectional density for the bore diameter. The ELD-X is accurate and holds together well while expanding in game.

[titsonritz]

If looking at a single round for both...7mm-08.

[JiminAZ]

I was hoping to get some more feedback from the OP on the hunt parameters and her range/skill level. But I have a few minutes here so thought I'd offer the experience below.

OK so she is of small frame and recoil sensitive. That falls into the category of youth/wimmen gun (whatever that is). I have a lot of experience with youth hunts, as I have 6 kids, and 5 of them hunt

I live out west, we have long ranges at times. I have seen our gun/bullet combinations perform or not and here's what I'd say.

The gun that has killed more mule deer than anything else in my safe is a Tikka T3 in 243. Lotta youth hunts on that one. The barnes TSX or Tipped TSX all passed through, all heart/lung or heart shots, all animals recovered no more than 70 yards from where shot. The solids have penciled through, obviously tumbling but we've never recovered even a fragment. At least 6 or 7 kills all went that way, all with varying degrees of blood trail. Closest 50 yards or so, farthest just over 200.

One California blacktail was shot with a 243 soft point 95 gr federal round - bullet recovered just under far side hide but did a ton of damage on the way across. No blood trail and gut shot. Took some tracking to find him but we did.

Also have a Tikka T3 6.5 CM using Hornady 143 ELDX. One Kaibab buck shot 327 yds quartering away right in pocket behind shoulder. Bounded twice and dead. Another Kaibab buck shot 125 yards as he got off his bed and walking away straight uphill. Shot just behind ribcage to right of spine (bullet on line to come out brisket given the incline). Went right down, started trying to come up with paralyzed back end 10-15 sec later, turned broadside one more in the boiler room fell right over and never moved again. Cow elk shot high at about 100 yards walked 15 yards and started to wobble, second shot better placed put her down where she stood.

Have a 7mmRem Mag 163 ELDX Tikka T3 shot a cow elk at about 80 yd mostly broadside dead right there. Another cow elk shot high above heart below spine (no-man's land) went about 20 yd and collapsed unable to walk but still alive. Required a finishing shot. Big bull elk 600 yds broadside went down with one shot.

By contrast shot a bull elk at 200 yd broadside with Berger hybrid, and bullet smashed through the near shoulder and destroyed the far shoulder (but didn't exit). Obviously held together way better than the ELDX.

Not one ELDX in either 6.5 CM or 7mm Rem Mag ever exited an animal in 6 total kills. Those bullets fragment all to heck when they hit. Efficient at killing but if you ever need to track..... you'd be in trouble. Fortunately we haven't needed to track because the bullets put them down. Most we've ever recovered is the cup base with some jacket still attached and a bit of lead in the base. The rest just blew all to hell. Have recovered jacket and lead fragments from meat fairly far off the "line" of the shot.

Oh yeah one of my boys shot a mountain lion at 530 yds with the 7MM Rem Mag 162 ELDX and yup, no exit.

If I had a do-over and was buying a youth gun today I would skip the 243 and go straight to the 6.5 CM. I'd still run the Tikka T3's they are just fantastic values. Then for a recoil sensitive person maybe a braked 6.5 PRC or braked 308 or 7-08 for Elk under 350 yards or so. I would use the solids to increase effectiveness with the smaller calibers while keeping the recoil under control.

Largest exit wound I have ever seen was a CA blacktail hit with 308 Fed Fusion at maybe 75 yd. Almost softball sized exit - deer bounded maybe 30 yards before going down, dumping 1/2 cup of blood with each bound.

Hit a little CA blacktail with 30-06 factory hornady SST 165 gr square on the shoulder at about 75 yd, and the bullet just went splat. Did not penetrate past the shoulder blade on a maybe 105 lb buck. Recovered the jacket from the shoulder blade, and the shoulder blade was cracked but remains of the bullet did not penetrate to vitals. The deer 3-leg limped along with that leg hanging before I put one behind the shoulder and he went down. I will never hunt with SST again.

Point is, bullet selection really makes a difference.

[AndyLate]

Not one ELDX in either 6.5 CM or 7mm Rem Mag ever exited an animal in 6 total kills. Those bullets fragment all to heck when they hit.

I would use the solids to increase effectiveness with the smaller calibers while keeping the recoil under control.

Point is, bullet selection really makes a difference.

Jim, are you using a bullet that tends to come apart and stay in the animal on purpose?

When you say solids, do you mean FMJ, or solid copper?

Thanks

Andy

[JiminAZ]

The ELDX is an efficient killer because it grenades inside. I have read many threads with people complaining of no exit but they aren't complaining that the animal wandered off to die somewhere else.

Haven't had any animal go more than 20 yards with an ELDX foreward of the diaphragm. I like it because it does grenade/kill, and shot placement is not always optimal with youth/new hunters. Hell in the field shot placement is not always optimal for experienced hunters too.

Yes solids I mean solid copper like the Barnes TSX and TTSX.

So it may seem like something of a contradiction, but I'm trying to find an answer for the OP that involves the right combo of recoil/killing power/range.

Until we know more from the OP on ranges and accuracy capabilities it's hard to hit that optimum so I guess I'm just giving him things to think about.

[Disciple]

Its basically between 25-06 and .270, but in a bore where heavy-for-caliber projectiles are common.

I remarked in a 6.5 Grendel vs 6.8 SPC thread that I thought market adoption would have been better for a single hybrid cartridge than both combined. The existing popularity of .270 Winchester would capture any pragmatic interest in this class, and those who like exclusivity would prefer something more exotic I suppose. The 25-06 is different enough to defend its niche.

[C-grunt]

The ELDX is an efficient killer because it grenades inside. I have read many threads with people complaining of no exit but they aren't complaining that the animal wandered off to die somewhere else.

Haven't had any animal go more than 20 yards with an ELDX foreward of the diaphragm. I like it because it does grenade/kill, and shot placement is not always optimal with youth/new hunters. Hell in the field shot placement is not always optimal for experienced hunters too.

Yes solids I mean solid copper like the Barnes TSX and TTSX.

So it may seem like something of a contradiction, but I'm trying to find an answer for the OP that involves the right combo of recoil/killing power/range.

Until we know more from the OP on ranges and accuracy capabilities it's hard to hit that optimum so I guess I'm just giving him things to think about.

Jim have you tried the solids in 308? I was reading on another forum where guys were pushing 130 TSX over 3000 FPS in the 308 and it was a hammer.