Walther and HK…

[MUFC]

I prefer Walthers myself, although I do not own a PDP myself. But isn’t the VP9 the way to go here?

[SteyrAUG]

I'm comparing what I have and not just regurgitating what the internet says. Plus the only HK I have left has the "match trigger" so yes it is apples to apples compared to my custom trigger guns.

Then don't presume to talk about stock firearms vs stock firearms. You started your HK comment with "out of the box."

[63Qcode]

I have both the Walther PDP and the PPQ M1 . The trigger on the PDP is nicer than the PPQ .... slightly less travel , shorter reset and a slightly cleaner break than my M1 . Having said that , I let a friend shoot my M1 to compare it to his VP9 , he sold the VP9 and carried the PPQ M1 .
That said , in my limited experience , triggers are very subjective as to what feels good to one person and not the other . If I`m target shooting , I want very little creep , a light trigger and a clean break . If practicing combat shooting etc , the trigger feel doesn`t matter ( to me ) that much as I`m not trying for one ragged hole .
I tried his VP9 and shot it as well as my PPQ M1 , but hated their paddle release vs the Walther paddle release . Sure wish the PDP had a paddle mag release ... but that`s my personal preference .

[jesuvuah]

I own most of the pistols on your list and your trigger job don’t count.

Nice try.

I can give my own account

DA/SA guns I have owned

Several p226 and p229, a few beretta 92s, a czp01 and p07, and 2 hk p30's

Out of all of those the hk had the worst stock triggers. I also had a p30 with a trigger job done by Robert Burke, it was much better, but still not on the same level as a sig with his trigger job, or a cgw cz, or an ltt beretta.

Do hk triggers suck? Not unless you compare them to the competition. My Friends usp expert is better then my p30, but it's still not on the same level as the competition. They are built like tanks though, and I can appreciate that, but the whole purpose for me of going to a hammer fired gun is to get a better trigger. If I want a crappy trigger, I will just carry one of my glocks.



Soli Deo Gloria

[Corse]

Back to the OP - apples and oranges between the P2000 and the PDP. The PDPs I've seen have phenom triggers IF you like a VERY lightweight precocked SF gun.

DA/SA is a whole nutta ballgame.

I've found P2000s to be pretty decent out of the box.

HKs are bombproof and their mags are made better than all other firearms. I think they get a bad rap on triggers, but there are reasons. Again, I've been tempted to pick up the P2000 before and those I've handled had a consistent and smooth DA and a decently light SA with only a tad of creep.

I have worked on 2 P30s - Safety model. Getting them DECENT is easier than CZs. Can they GET to the point where they are as good as a Cajunized CZ? No way. BUT, with the change of two springs and a polish job, the DA is smooth and bears only a little stacking at the very rear which is easy to blow through in DA, and the SA has minimal creep and light break. They DO have a longer SA throw than a REGULAR P01, and similar to the Omega - maybe a tad more. Fore some people this is a deal.

In GENERAL - I have found in my limited experience that getting a P30 to have a smooth DA is easier to do than getting that in a CZ in general. The problem with CZs is the inconsistency. One CZ can have a nearly perfect pull OTB, and with swapping to CGW parts, (sometimes $300+) will be an AMAZING trigger - and you can do it yourself.

But, some CZs are MISERABLE. I've spent a ton of hours on a P01 Omega and FINALLY have it right now, and even with a few hundred in CGW parts still has a tiny bit of stacking at the rear before the DA break. Only through a ton of experimentation and polishing is it now silky smooth through the pull, and even the CGW hammer ($88) has a tiny creep before the SA break. As one smith at CGW says, some CZs you can never get completely right. Its the way it is.

I even have a 'regular' P01 with all CGW parts - it is a nice gun and the SA break is like a custom 1911. However, the DA still stacks a bit - but because the DA pull is short and sweet otherwise, you can hit with it. But most would not like the stacking. When I purchased the gun online it was ATROCIOUS - and many DA/SA CZs are. (The problem with CZs is that they are scarce and you almost need to buy online sight unseen. Advise - go to a big show and try it and pay more but know what you are getting).

Walthers. I've never picked up a PPQ that did not have a phenom trigger. I've also never had a Malf in a P99 - rock solid. I do not have experience with the PDP.

Tell me more about the P30S trigger jobs.

[SteyrAUG]

I can give my own account

DA/SA guns I have owned

Several p226 and p229, a few beretta 92s, a czp01 and p07, and 2 hk p30's

Out of all of those the hk had the worst stock triggers. I also had a p30 with a trigger job done by Robert Burke, it was much better, but still not on the same level as a sig with his trigger job, or a cgw cz, or an ltt beretta.

Do hk triggers suck? Not unless you compare them to the competition. My Friends usp expert is better then my p30, but it's still not on the same level as the competition. They are built like tanks though, and I can appreciate that, but the whole purpose for me of going to a hammer fired gun is to get a better trigger. If I want a crappy trigger, I will just carry one of my glocks.



Soli Deo Gloria

Guns I have owned and shot for more than 20-30 years.

SIG P226, CZ75, Beretta 92FS, HK USP.

Hands down the P226 is the best trigger "for me" (and I say for me because this is opinion and it's subjective every time. If you are not used to stock triggers...you will SUCK with stock triggers...it's a YOU thing. Just like people who weren't raised on DA/SA triggers usually suck with them) And by 'YOU" I don't specifically mean the person I happened to quote.

The HK USP was next best for me, didn't seem to break as clean but still very nice.

The CZ and the Beretta are among the worst triggers of any handgun I actually own (not counting the VP70), lots of take up on the trigger pull and very far from a crisp and clean break. But somehow they both still perform well.

My P7 will clown them all, but P7s tend to be exceptions to the rules.

[HKGuns]

Guns I have owned and shot for more than 20-30 years.

SIG P226, CZ75, Beretta 92FS, HK USP.

Hands down the P226 is the best trigger "for me" (and I say for me because this is opinion and it's subjective every time. If you are not used to stock triggers...you will SUCK with stock triggers...it's a YOU thing. Just like people who weren't raised on DA/SA triggers usually suck with them) And by 'YOU" I don't specifically mean the person I happened to quote.

The HK USP was next best for me, didn't seem to break as clean but still very nice.

The CZ and the Beretta are among the worst triggers of any handgun I actually own (not counting the VP70), lots of take up on the trigger pull and very far from a crisp and clean break. But somehow they both still perform well.

My P7 will clown them all, but P7s tend to be exceptions to the rules.

Agree 100% on all counts.

[m4brian]

The CZ and the Beretta are among the worst triggers of any handgun I actually own (not counting the VP70), lots of take up on the trigger pull and very far from a crisp and clean break. But somehow they both still perform well.

While I own too many CZs, I would agree with much of this. It is amazing to me (even outside the P10 series) of the pass the CZ gets on triggers. Most I've bought I've had to do massive Cajunizing AND polishing - even messing with the trigger bar on the P series. YET - because of the ergonomics, they shoot well. In part this is the case, because the DA trigger throw is reasonable. They also point well and stay on target naturally despite the sucky pulls.

[Adrenaline_6]

Tell me more about the P30S trigger jobs.

Gray Guns and Lazy Wolf has them. You can buy the Short Reset Kit also from Gray Guns and install it yourself. I installed the kit on my P30S along with a 10Lb Wolf trigger spring and a light firing ping block spring. I have a few thousand rounds on it so, yes, the DA is still long, but it is smooth and the break is clean and the reset although still longer by todays standards, is a third shorter.

[Stopsign32v]

Then don't presume to talk about stock firearms vs stock firearms. You started your HK comment with "out of the box."

All of my firearms were stock at some point, including all of my HKs.