Pistol brace ban: Who's the maker and what happens to the ones in dealer inventory

[kerplode]

If they don't know what you have by admission, you become felon how?

At the stroke of midnight 120 days after the publication date, mere possession becomes a felony. But yeah, I suppose if you just leave your braced pistol in the closet and take it out once a month to jerk off to it, then you're probably pretty safe. Just don't ever have the cops over to your house for any reason. Oh and if you do take it to the range, don't break any traffic laws or get into any accidents...

Also, you realize this is the NFA forum, right? You're going "Derr...Don't register!" at a bunch of dudes that are already in the NFA game.

[DwayneZ]

At the stroke of midnight 120 days after the publication date, mere possession becomes a felony. But yeah, I suppose if you just leave your braced pistol in the closet and take it out once a month to jerk off to it, then you're probably pretty safe. Just don't ever have the cops over to your house for any reason. Oh and if you do take it to the range, don't break any traffic laws or get into any accidents...

Also, you realize this is the NFA forum, right? You're going "Derr...Don't register!" at a bunch of dudes that are already in the NFA game.

So skip all this ATF BS. Just submit regular form-1 for SBR and pay the $200. This at least removes the risk of not getting approved and becoming instant felon.

You do realize how silly it sounds when you say "everyone here is in the NFA game"? NFA needs to be abolished, and those "in it" are not helping. HPA bill is back in the House too.

So be it, as usual. there's a choice.

[kerplode]

OK...

So whether the NFA needs to be abolished or not is largely irrelevant because it's not going to be abolished.

[Renegade]

There is no Form 4999...

Yes there is, it is on the website and you use it to determine if you have a stock or not. Almost all "braces" will score out as stocks though.

[kerplode]

Yes there is, it is on the website and you use it to determine if you have a stock or not. Almost all "braces" will score out as stocks though.

No...There was a Form 4999 in a previous revision of the ruling, but it's no longer a thing. It's not part of the final ruling and it won't be used to determine shit, regardless of where you find it.

From page 9 of the final ruling, made bold and large for the reading impared.
https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...espdf/download

After careful consideration of the comments received regarding the complexity in
understanding the proposed Worksheet 4999 and the methodology used in the Worksheet
to evaluate firearms equipped with a “brace” device, this final rule does not adopt some
aspects of the approach proposed in the NPRM, specifically the Worksheet 4999 and its
point system. Instead, based on the comments received, the Department took the relevant
criteria discussed in the NPRM and Worksheet 4999 that indicate when a firearm is
designed, made, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and incorporated them into
the rule’s revised definitions of rifle.

[Renegade]

No...There was a Form 4999 in a previous revision of the ruling, but it's no longer a thing. It's not part of the final ruling and it won't be used to determine shit, regardless of where you find it.

From page 9 of the final ruling, made bold and large for the reading impared.
https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regula...espdf/download

Fair enough - as soon as this is published that goes into effect.

Instead, based on the comments received, the Department took the relevant
criteria discussed in the NPRM and Worksheet 4999 that indicate when a firearm is
designed, made, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and incorporated them into
the rule’s revised definitions of rifle.

Tomayto/Tomahto

[DwayneZ]

The innovators should be in design phase now. Monolithic rear-end with a sawtooth fin that has a strap (alumnum tube with a molded over plastic rear fin, made in different lengths). INTENDED to be used as arm brace to operate the pistol one handed, AND, sawtooth discourages operating the firearm from shoulder.
And get this, their "as seen being used" criteria cannot apply to new designs, because they don't exist for the ATF idiots to watch how people operate their firearm.
BTW, how one operates their legally configured firearm has no standing, they cannot tell you how you can or cannot operate your LEGAL firearm.
Idiots at ATF. 4999 would have been harder. Now with one rear-end design all of the BS new rule "criteria" is tossed in the garbage.

After careful consideration of the comments received regarding the complexity in
understanding the proposed Worksheet 4999 and the methodology used in the Worksheet
to evaluate firearms equipped with a “brace” device, this final rule does not adopt some
aspects of the approach proposed in the NPRM, specifically the Worksheet 4999 and its
point system. Instead, based on the comments received, the Department took the relevant
criteria discussed in the NPRM and Worksheet 4999 that indicate when a firearm is
designed, made, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and incorporated them into
the rule’s revised definitions of rifle.

Right, the actual 4999 is not in the final BS. What they are saying is, although 4999 is not in final we used 4999 as the basis to write the criteria that is in our BS final rule.

All of the new rule criteria is based on 4999. Yeah, looks like ATF idiots tried hard to base the whole thing on "rear surface", but like I said, a sawtooth fin takes care of that stupid crap.
You can place meth needles to your shoulder too, needles are points like sawtooth fins, but pushing them into the shoulder is gonna be "painful".

[pinzgauer]

Saw a video on YouTube where one of the GOA lawyers had been speaking with the ATF out at the shot show on some hypotheticals.

He specifically questioned them what happens if you do the amnesty form one registration thing and the background check is failed for whatever reason.

The ATF agent said they would initiate an enforcement action because you have already sent them specifics on the firearm and they know you have an unregistered NFA item.

Which gets scary as there is an 88-day rule that any background check not cleared in 88 days is automatically denied. Which could significantly increase the volume of denied background checks and thus enforcement actions.

It gets worse because the ATF and the FBI are fighting over the background checks and the ATF has taking that over. They're struggling with volume already with the implication that rate of erroneous denials due to name clashes or similar errors increasing.

Now add potentially millions of form ones and that spike and background check volume. He pressed the agent would they be able to handle the volume and would they still initiate enforcement action if the ATF just couldn't get it processed in time.

At first the agent indicated yes it would still be an enforcement action, but then said he would need to talk to us a superior. So he went the next level up and got very similar answers and non answers.

He now has the card of someone at division headquarters or whatever and is going to try to work with them.

GOA point of view is that using the amnesty registration is extremely dangerous as you have to provide them with information that would prove your guilt if there is a failed background check. Or even just a delayed one.

You are literally arming them with everything they need to successfully prosecute you when you apply.

I don't have a horse in this race, but this situation seems both dangerous and half-baked at the same time.

I expect over time in the right court it will be overthrown, but between now and then you could go to prison or pay huge fines.

[mr h]

I agree with this. They have no idea what they are doing.

its either a honeypot or the atf is just really THAT stupid

thinking the later because the atf is like a menstruating woman. irrational and always changing their mind.

[33XRAY]

The pistol brace thing is an insurrection. We had peace, and then they flipped the script like an angry girlfriend.