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Thread: 16" Barrel Recommendations for Solid Copper Bullets

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ST911 View Post
    Point of comparison, unsuppressed the BHA 5.56 62 TSX is typically ~2900fps from 16" barrels. So your Barnes-loaded is +100fps with the suppressor boost.
    Yet another reason to love suppressors!

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by georgeib View Post

    You bring up a very good point, as @markm did. I did end up with a few thousand rounds at sub 50˘ per, so I couldn't pass them up. Certainly not a barrels full, but enough to satisfy my precision-ish AR shooting for a few years. I tend to go through a fair amount of m193 at a rapid ROF, but do enjoy going out to the 700 yard range a handful of times per year. Enough so, that I have been considering a more precision orientated upper (that will inevitably grow a lower, I know) for several years.
    I bought a small pile of SS109 pills once and tried them (new bullets only / loading my own ammo) in several precision barrels. I tried multiple different powders and loadings out of multiple different barrels. Chambers ranging from real .223 match to honked out 5.56 Colt.

    Was a complete and utter waste of time and barrel life that only proved one thing to me. That being that a crappy bullet does not somehow become a 'precision / match grade' bullet just because you send it downrange out of an otherwise good barrel. A turd bullet is still a turd bullet at the end of the day.

    I still got a few k of those SS109 pills left. Blaster pills for beater barrels is the only reason I kept what I did.

    Would had more fun shooting real match grade pills and spent less time on load development to get to 'good' results on paper.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by georgeib View Post
    Last year I acquired a substantial amount of Black Hills GMX 70gr and Barnes VOR TX 70gr. After testing both rounds in a 16" 1 in 8 barrel and a couple 11.5" 1 in 7 barrels, I'm less than impressed with the accuracy I've been getting.

    I suspect it has a lot to do with the length and hardness of the Hornady and Barnes copper bullets making them difficult to properly stabilize in slower twist or shorter barrels. I also wonder if the rifling is getting a sufficient purchase on the harder material. So I'm looking at building a 16" or 18" SPR type upper with a 1 in 7 twist barrel in an effort to sufficiently stabilize these things. I suppose I could be convinced to go to a 20", but I still want to be able to carry this rifle extensively, if need be, so weight is a consideration. And it will be suppressed which adds substantial length and weight way up front.

    Some of the barrels I've been considering are the SPR barrels from WOA. And possibly a Black Hole Weaponry barrel if I can convince them to build me one with their newly developed "claw" rifling which is supposed to work well specifically on all copper bullets. I have one of their standard polygonal barrels in a 308 AR build, and I'm pleased with its performance, FWIW.

    Any ideas, or experiences getting better accuracy with all copper bullets? Barrel recommendations? Will a 223 Wylde barrel be a hindrance to these 5.56 rounds?
    Don't know if you know or it has been said but solid copper bullets shoot best when the bore has been cleaned to the bare metal and then you shoot that brand and only that brand.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by constructor View Post
    Don't know if you know or it has been said but solid copper bullets shoot best when the bore has been cleaned to the bare metal and then you shoot that brand and only that brand.
    Thank you. I'd been considering this. Will break out the Boretech Eliminator and clean out the barrels and try again.
    “You have made us for yourself, O Lord, and our heart is restless until it rests in you.” -Augustine

  5. #25
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    I've lost track of the objective here, OP and the problem we're trying to solve.

    Reset: Copper solids vs conventional jacketed is just a bullet construction attribute. Copper solids are some of the best around for certain tasks. Some barrels like some bullets and loadings better than others, particular barrels and some runs of them have personalities. 50-70gr will fly in SBRs to SPRs, in 1/7 or 1/8, when loaded well. Copper fouling isn't the thing many think. Shoot and see? I think we're lost in the weeds.
    2012 National Zumba Endurance Champion
    الدهون القاع الفتيات لك جعل العالم هزاز جولة الذهاب

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ST911 View Post
    I've lost track of the objective here, OP and the problem we're trying to solve.

    Reset: Copper solids vs conventional jacketed is just a bullet construction attribute. Copper solids are some of the best around for certain tasks. Some barrels like some bullets and loadings better than others, particular barrels and some runs of them have personalities. 50-70gr will fly in SBRs to SPRs, in 1/7 or 1/8, when loaded well. Copper fouling isn't the thing many think. Shoot and see? I think we're lost in the weeds.
    My objective is mainly to pick an excellent SPR type 16" barrel with a 1 in 7 twist, which will shoot MOA or better, and which will give me excellent accuracy with long all copper bullets while producing a gyroscopic stability factor of over 1.5.

    Some folks are getting good accuracy with 1 in 8 barrels, but because this only gives a stability factor of 1.33, will still have yaw affecting BC and precision at longer distances. Besides trying to pick a good 1 in 7 barrel, I also wonder how much a 5.56 vs Wylde chamber will affect accuracy in 5.56 loaded ammunition. Specifically the Barnes 70gr tsx and the BH 70gr gmx.
    “You have made us for yourself, O Lord, and our heart is restless until it rests in you.” -Augustine

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ST911 View Post
    I've lost track of the objective here, OP and the problem we're trying to solve.

    Reset: Copper solids vs conventional jacketed is just a bullet construction attribute. Copper solids are some of the best around for certain tasks. Some barrels like some bullets and loadings better than others, particular barrels and some runs of them have personalities. 50-70gr will fly in SBRs to SPRs, in 1/7 or 1/8, when loaded well. Copper fouling isn't the thing many think. Shoot and see? I think we're lost in the weeds.
    Wishing I had a “like” button…..

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by georgeib View Post
    I did end up with a few thousand rounds at sub 50˘ per, so I couldn't pass them up.
    Could the problem not be the barrels or bullets, but the loaded rounds themselves?

    Have you tried these bullets loaded by a different manufacturer or at least lot?

    How did you acquire them for a 1/3 of what they normally cost? Had someone else already decided they were not accurate and dumped them?

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMS951 View Post
    Could the problem not be the barrels or bullets, but the loaded rounds themselves?

    Have you tried these bullets loaded by a different manufacturer or at least lot?

    How did you acquire them for a 1/3 of what they normally cost? Had someone else already decided they were not accurate and dumped them?
    Valid point well worth considering.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMS951 View Post
    Could the problem not be the barrels or bullets, but the loaded rounds themselves?

    Have you tried these bullets loaded by a different manufacturer or at least lot?

    How did you acquire them for a 1/3 of what they normally cost? Had someone else already decided they were not accurate and dumped them?
    Good question.

    I hadn't tried them from anyone else. And they are all from one lot, respectively. All the BH and all the Barnes.

    I got them from someone who needed to generate some cash quickly, and was selling off a bunch of guns and ammo for firesale prices. I also picked up cases of IMI 77gr and some 9mm ammo. I spent a chunk of change, but it was well worth it in the long run. Or so I thought.

    I had read, besides constructor's suggestion, that the all copper bullets do like to be shot through barrels unfouled by other rounds, so I will see if that makes any difference in my Sionics 11.5 barrels. I'll have some data on Tuesday when the range opens.

    I do still want to build an SPR upper that will handle these rounds well though.
    Last edited by georgeib; 04-23-23 at 11:51.
    “You have made us for yourself, O Lord, and our heart is restless until it rests in you.” -Augustine

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