rancher who held ilegals at gunpoint trial starts !

[Jay Cunningham]

I also got told that by a mob on TOS once when I criticized a guy who was bragging about running outside and holding a guy at gunpoint because he caught him walking on his lawn.

It turns out he worked for the telephone company - but he was "on his property" so he needed to confront him at gunpoint, apparently.

As some have pointed out, we don't yet know enough about this case. However I have no problem thinking for myself and not automatically being a cheerleader for the guy with the gun.

[Zane Zackerly]

As some have pointed out, we don't yet know enough about this case. However I have no problem thinking for myself and not automatically being a cheerleader for the guy with the gun.

I agree up to a point; however, when you're the one outnumbered and having to confront the trespassers, your mindset is a whole lot different. And when the trespassers are armed it's a whole new ball game.

I recently had to run some hunters off. They were just teens or college kids with Fudd rifles out hunting rabbits. The problem is, they were shooting in my direction and in the direction of the house. I could hear rounds whizzing by me and impacting near my feet. I was not about to confront them without being armed. I chambered a round in my AK, but did not point it at them. I politely asked them not to shoot in my direction or in the direction of the house. As they were not on my property, I didn't try to run them off.

Now, had the situation been different and one of them had lifted his weapon to threaten me, I would have left them both lying in the dust.

I also wonder if they would have been as compliant had I not been armed?

[dwhitehorne]

You're right - I'm what's wrong with America. I've been told that by the open carry advocates as well.

You are not what is wrong with America. You are from PA and I'm from VA and we have no idea what this homeowner is going through living on the border. I can only imagine he is at his wits end with trespassers destroying his property. I just think we should give the gun owner and not the illegals the benifit of the doubt in this situation. David

[John_Wayne777]

You're right - I'm what's wrong with America. I've been told that by the open carry advocates as well.

What did they call you in the Utah mall "Would you go back in?" thread?

[Gramps]

To ME, this sometimes reads that there are those who seem to think it is OK for our Country to be invaded by those who wish to not obey our policies. Such as coming here the legal way. Were/are these people only defending there property? Or are they trying to also defend their/your Country, which also is THEIR property? Without living in those border towns and seeing what all is going on, we from afar don't really have a clue, do we.

Should we just eliminate the Mexico border? Or should we defend it against Illegal Intruders? After all what goes on on the East Coast, doesn't effect me here in Montana, so should I tell everyone on the East Coast that they are wrong in the way they handle things there? When I don't know their circumstances?

[ZDL]

Not sure why everyone is getting defensive and angry over this. Telling Katar that he is what is wrong with America is the only out of line thing I've seen.

Relax dummies.

[jaydoc1]

I live in Colorado in a city which is about 67% Hispanic. Of that 67%, approximately 22% are illegally in this country. I don't live on the border but I do frequently talk with those who have tried to keep out illegals and those that ARE illegals.

What many non-border dwelling types don't understand is not just the influx of "peaceful" illegals, but the swelling tide of vicious drug-smuggling cartels which frequently have the Mexican government out-gunned and absolutely have our border guards out-gunned. Frequently there are armed mercenary escorts into our country of the coyotes who are not just bringing people, but drugs as well. The folks living on the border are in very real fear for their lives from these types who don't hesitate to shoot first.

Now I'm not suggesting this group of individuals was in any way associated with drug smuggling. What I am suggesting is that this rancher was probably a little hyper-vigilant because of it and may have over-reacted.

Our society is so regional that often while we may have some idea what goes on in other areas of the country, we usually don't have a full grasp of the goings-on in the daily life of those from other areas. I liken this to the urban gun-haters absolute inability to understand why anyone would possibly need to own a gun. Truly if they've never had any exposure to them then why would anyone else need or want to use them?

I only postulate this as a reason for what seems like extreme over-reacting in this rancher's case. Until you've walked a mile in his shoes...

BTW, for those who really have no experience with what is really taking place on our southern border may I suggest viewing the documentary "Border" for a little insight. http://www.bordermovie.com/

[warpigM-4]

You're right - I'm what's wrong with America. I've been told that by the open carry advocates as well.

don't put yourself in that group .you just have a different opinion of what you would do in that situation .If i lived on the border I would have a Phone number for the Border patrol .and ask them what would be the SOP for this type of situation so I would not ended up Like this guy.

[A-Bear680]

It might be interesting to look at the court records .

Feb. 3, 2009 09:24 AM
Associated Press
TUCSON - The trial is now under way in a civil-rights lawsuit against a southern Arizona rancher accused of holding a group of illegal immigrants at gunpoint near Douglas.

.... ( Snip for brevity)....

The federal lawsuit charges Barnett, his wife, Barbara Barnett, and his brother, Donald Barnett, with conspiring to violate the plaintiffs' civil rights, according to the release.

U.S. District Court Judge John Roll in March rejected Barnett's efforts to have the charges thrown out, ruling that sufficient evidence of a conspiracy existed, that the Barnetts denied the immigrants' right to interstate travel and that the actions of the three were motivated by race.

... (Snip for brevity ).......

Roll's ruling came on the heels of another judgment against Barnett in February 2008.

At that time, the Arizona Court of Appeals refused to throw out a jury verdict from November 2006 - and a nearly $100,000 monetary award - against Barnett in another civil case where a jury concluded he falsely imprisoned members of a Douglas family.

The current trial is scheduled to go through Feb. 13.

There's an old case and a new case. I agree that there is something very wrong with illegal aliens having a right to interstate travel. This case is just getting started.
The false imprisonment case might shed some light on situation. Maybe Mr. Barnett is getting screwed twice.
Maybe there's some lessons on how to prevail and stay out of jail ( and not lose a lawsuit) along the border.

ETA:
I think that what I'm driving here is that there's these two cases and there's the symbol. There's a huge problem on the border , no doubt . One question is what can people do without getting nailed for "...nearly $100,000..."

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Can you actually hold someone at gun point for tresspass (posted, non-posted?)? In the house in one thing, at the other extreme is unposted land. Down south near the border with drug gangs and MexMil, things are a bit different, I understand.