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Thread: Educate me on 10.5" and cans....

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by markm View Post
    Cool. I'm still nutty about sending longer bullets thru my can.
    Same here. I had several endcap strikes shooting factory fresh brand new IMI m855 through a Colt 6721 upper with an SWR Specwar-2 attached. Thankfully the can was not destroyed and after a short trip back to SWR, Joe confirmed that it was in no way adversely affected. But after that experience I stopped shooting heavy bullets through a suppressor on a 1:9 twist barrel. Could it have been the ammo? Sure and my experience is purely anecdotal and non-scientific.

  2. #22
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    Josh,
    this time I did type it correctly. They effectively last forever because the manufacturer will service them at no charge. Thats what I meant, and thats what is plainly written in my post.

    I wasnt trying to say that they do last forever. If I was, I would not have used the word "effectively".

    Re Gemtax - what are you refering to?? Theres no tax for the original manufacturer to replace the internals of its own product. Perhaps you should do a bit more reading. Besides, the Gemtax is a misnomer (putting on nomex underware), it should be called the AACGemtax.

    Don

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcmdon View Post
    Re Gemtax - what are you refering to?? Theres no tax for the original manufacturer to replace the internals of its own product. Perhaps you should do a bit more reading. Besides, the Gemtax is a misnomer (putting on nomex underware), it should be called the AACGemtax.
    If the manuf can't repair or practically replace the internals, you get stuck with a new can and a new tax stamp.

    Gemtec might be able to disasemble their cans, but I don't think AAC (for example) is able to do this. Their cores are welded, then welded into the tube. It's great for durability, but it's not easily repaired if you get a struck baffle.

  4. #24
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    So I guess its better called an AACTax then. Hmm.

    Don
    p.s. I'm just stirring up the shit. I understand that the term came from Gemtech "blowing the whistle" on AAC's "upgrade" process that actually replaced the entire suppressor.

  5. #25
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    Well I can see that your knowledge far exceeds mine so I will avoid trying to figure out what you are trying to say in the future and just "do more reading" about how awesome Gemtech is....

  6. #26
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    Longer bullets are generally more likely to have baffle strikes that shorter.
    TRACER bullets are much more likely to have baffle strikes than FMJ or OTM's.

    Cans on short 5.56mm guns errode the baffles much more quickly than longer guns, even on semi-auto. If you are a non governmental suppressor user, you want to use a mount that has a intial blast baffle built into it, as depending on construction this can double or triple the life of your can.





    I've blown out several cans in my day

    Out at the range in Afghan, we took a bunch of pics one day.







    I've got some pics of KAC, Gemtech, OpsInc, Br-Tuote, Brugger and Thommett etc. cans that I or co-workers have blown.

    The KAC we damaged at work, shooting a NT3 on a Stoner LMG Short Barrel, a M856 tracer did a U turn down the pipe and an unpleasant end cap strike occured.


    Worst suppressor issue I have seen was a B&T SOPS M4 can that literally detonated and several onlookers took shrapnel off the can body . B&T admitted shipping a defective bunch of cans later, but one of the guys wife's who was on looking still had a 15 stick cut in her face...
    Kevin S. Boland
    Manager, Federal Sales
    FN America, LLC
    Office: 703.288.3500 x181 | Mobile: 407-451-4544 | Fax: 703.288.4505
    www.fnhusa.com

  7. #27
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    Please tell me where I said Gemtech was awesome. I cant seem to find that.
    Dig that up for me and let me know.

    So in case you need it spelled out agaon. My point was that the M4-02 is small, light, and cheap. It is nowhere near the most effective can you can buy for an AR. But represents a reasonable compromise based on my requirements, between size, cost and effectiveness.

    I do believe that continuously welded AAC cans are generally tougher and quieter. The downside (and there is always a compromise in any engineering decision) is cost and the added difficulty in rebuilding an AAC.

    The closest equivalent AAC can is the Ranger 2. Similar cost, similar weight, and most likely similar performance. (speculation, I havent heard the Ranger 2, but even AAC says that it is nowhere near as quiet as their larger .223 cans) If I was a military guy who needed the toughest suppressor possible it would not be a non-welded Gemtech.

    But as a civilian, the risks my suppressors face are not thermal destruction caused by the need to shoot 500 rounds during a 15 minute firefight. Rather the risks to my cans are:
    1) baffle strike
    2) corrosion

    With respect to both of those risks, I am better served by the less stoutly built, but more easily repairable Gemtech.

    The fact that I was able to pick up a dealer demo for $150 off MSRP makes it a no-brainer.

    Don

    How is that. Logical?

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcmdon View Post
    But as a civilian, the risks my suppressors face are not thermal destruction caused by the need to shoot 500 rounds during a 15 minute firefight. Rather the risks to my cans are:
    1) baffle strike
    2) corrosion
    You really can't live in fear of a baffle strike. It's like worrying about a car accident.

    And as far as corrosion, you're best bet is inconel baffles. I think even the Ranger can has inconel. I'm making that assumption because AAC has said that the Ranger baffle stack is the same as the M4-1000, and it has inconel baffels.

    But you got a good price on your can. Nothing says you won't want another one after you get this one. I know I bought a second can after my first.

  9. #29
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    I dont worry about baffle strikes. But its nice to know that if I have one, the manufacturer can open it up and replace the baffles without me having to spring for another stamp.

    This M402 will most likely spend its life locktited to the end of my 10.5" upper. So its nice to know that if I have corrosion problems with the inner tube, it can be removed from the outer tube without another stamp.

    Of course I'll store it tip down and shoot some boeshield in it when possible. But if corrosion happens I should be covered.

    God only knows if my logic will pan out. But it makes sense at this point.

    Again, I realize this could be completely avoided by purchasing a can made from inconnel and stainless, but I'm not going to be buyint ghat for less than 400

    Don

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcmdon View Post
    I dont worry about baffle strikes. But its nice to know that if I have one, the manufacturer can open it up and replace the baffles without me having to spring for another stamp.


    Silencers of this method of construction are the most likely to have a baffle strike.
    Last edited by scottryan; 04-10-09 at 15:24.
    "Not every thing on Earth requires an aftermarket upgrade." demigod/markm

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