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Thread: Piston or Gas?

  1. #121
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    I love my gas.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by clickclack View Post
    seriously im gratefull for USMC03 reviews and info but jesus you plug that BCM sht whenever you can dont you..



    got a kickback deal with them or what? oh wait they sell your chest harness dont they! bet you get deals on parts too...

    seriously i own a BCM upper and i own some piston guns.. to say the DI runs better is blasphemy....

    you want to do some real testing without operator/mags/ammo.... variables and then the BCM comes out on top then so be it.. but i would be willing to bet a hefty penny on the gas system lasting a hell of lot longer then a DI gun given the same treatment equally.

    wait didnt the military already do this test... what was the outcome again
    Publicy accusing a well respected moderator that constantly provides information and experience with being dishonest or receiving kick-backs will not stand.

    As it is, BCM makes an excellent product. I frequently recommend them, as do many others, are we also being accused of dishonesty or financial gain through morally questionable practices?

    I suggest that you seriously consider the consequences of your accusations and comments before posting.

    P.S.- I am a "real" trigger puller, and I can tell you that I prefer mature, proven designs, as do others with higher technical knowledge.
    Last edited by Failure2Stop; 01-24-10 at 22:55.
    Jack Leuba
    Director, Military and Government Sales
    Knight's Armament Company
    jleuba@knightarmco.com

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by clickclack View Post
    Look buddy.. I respect USMC03 and i actually have spent time on his site reading and taking in stuff. He will for sure be more of a valuable asset to this forum then I.

    BUT I think its unfair to other members who might not know the affiliations certain posters have with certain companies. that said i think DI guns are great if you maintain them right.. There are pro's and cons for both systems..

    without going to much into my credentials (which i shouldnt have to justify to post on a forum anyways) I know for a fact that special operations run Gas sytems and sigs........ NOT DI AR's and Glocks butt reading the internet one would think a colt ar and glock 19 are the end all in firearms.. well NOT SO MUCH!

    ive spoken to reall Trigger pullers about this subject and They Prefer gas systems. over the DI gun....

    some of you guys might just be too Long toothed to accept the future in firearms..

    some of you might have invested interest in DI.. some of you might just be ignorant to the facts.. IDK
    That's funny, because one click over to the article that Jeff linked, or the link in his Sig line would disclose that. Or when someone went to BCM's site and saw the 03 rig.

    As for speaking to real trigger pullers, you are not the only one who has. I dunno who you spoke to about what is and is not in use...but you might want to check your sources, if you even think it matters.
    Last edited by Jim D; 01-24-10 at 22:54.

  4. #124
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    Thumbs down

    Dude I'm sure all of us that love and recommend BCM "rides their jock-strap" I can agree with you to a point; I have no particular brand loyalty BUT when a brand makes an excellent product at a good price (BCM, Magpul, etc.) then I will always recommend them to others. You said it yourself; you want the best equipment. The way I see it, the BCM can be considered "the best" in DI AR-15s because its built to the same standards as a Colt but without the heavier price tag. When well known professionals like USMC03 or Pat Rogers tout the BCM, I'll call that a clue.

    As for pistons, I too wish the military uses service rifles/carbines with piston systems. Our rifles are select fire, issued to many different servicemen, and the more high speed guys may use suppressors on SBRs. I hate having to clean my M4 after shooting it, especially to the USMC "white glove" standard which I no longer do thankfully. I still don't like a system that blows the gas directly back into the working heart of the weapon, however, the DI AR has been around for nearly 50 years and has been improved during that time. Cleaning the BCG can suck but its not that bad at the same time.

    I own a LWRC M6A2 upper, LMT MRP CQB piston upper, and a DDM4 and BCM BFH middy upper. I like all of them and have confidence in them to survive a deployment but I do feel most users, including myself, DON'T need the advantages of a piston system. That doesn't mean I hate pistons, in fact I love them, but the AR has proven to run well on a system that theoretically shouldn't. I recommend anyone getting into an AR first should go with a QUALITY DI rifle, (BCM, Colt...) then after some experience try a piston driven system. (LWRC, LMT...)
    Last edited by lawusmc0844; 01-24-10 at 23:14. Reason: To add some additional stuff.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failure2Stop View Post
    Piblicy accusing a well respected moderator that constantly provides information and experience with being dishonest or receiving kick-backs will not stand.

    As it is, BCM makes an excellent product. I frequently recommend them, as do many others, are we also being accused of dishonesty or financial gain through morally questionable practices?

    I suggest that you seriously consider the consequences of your accusations and comments before posting.

    Noted. I may have worded my post incorrectly to get my point across.

    I too believe BCM makes a great product and my current build is actually a BCM. I also planned to get the harness that Jeff had designed.

    I just felt the " Ive seen gas systems go down and the all mighty BCM has never failed post with a link about how great bcm thing to be a little bit "hidden agenda" for lack of better words and i wanted to get the word out there that the gas system is a great system in the right design.



    my bad

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by clickclack View Post
    Noted. I may have worded my post incorrectly to get my point across.

    I too believe BCM makes a great product and my current build is actually a BCM. I also planned to get the harness that Jeff had designed.

    I just felt the " Ive seen gas systems go down and the all mighty BCM has never failed post with a link about how great bcm thing to be a little bit "hidden agenda" for lack of better words and i wanted to get the word out there that the gas system is a great system in the right design.



    my bad
    You are trying to argue "gas systems" when you're actually talking about gas PISTON systems. The fact that you aren't even clearly identifying/know the proper name for what you're trying to plug, is clue #1 for us.

    More importantly, though...the guys here who've already weighed in have been around the block, and have seen what actually runs, and what doesn't.

    Jeff's affiliation with BCM is easy to see for those who care, you're not exposing anything that people don't already know.

    As for trying to educate folks about the potential of the gas piston AR systems... this is where you'll need to be highly detailed and specific if you want anyone to take you even remotely seriously.

    When there are gents here who helped develop the various systems on the market, have used and broken pretty much every piston system out there, been shooting DI carbines for 20+ years, etc....you should probably explain how you "know better" than they do.

    If you can't do this I'd recommend going back to lurking, and not shooting off at the mouth and embarrassing yourself quiet so badly.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by CoolBreeze View Post
    You are trying to argue "gas systems" when you're actually talking about gas PISTON systems. The fact that you aren't even clearly identifying/know the proper name for what you're trying to plug, is clue #1 for us.

    More importantly, though...the guys here who've already weighed in have been around the block, and have seen what actually runs, and what doesn't.

    Jeff's affiliation with BCM is easy to see for those who care, you're not exposing anything that people don't already know.

    As for trying to educate folks about the potential of the gas piston AR systems... this is where you'll need to be highly detailed and specific if you want anyone to take you even remotely seriously.

    When there are gents here who helped develop the various systems on the market, have used and broken pretty much every piston system out there, been shooting DI carbines for 20+ years, etc....you should probably explain how you "know better" than they do.

    If you can't do this I'd recommend going back to lurking, and not shooting off at the mouth and embarrassing yourself quiet so badly.
    oh so then by your wording.. every gas piston must be designed the same huh?

    seriously if anyone wants to run a real wold test of a DI vs GAS to find out which one lasts longer please let me know the outcome.

  8. #128
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    Both sides have been heard and weighed.
    This thread has detoured significantly enough to become a distraction.
    I am closing it down.
    Jack Leuba
    Director, Military and Government Sales
    Knight's Armament Company
    jleuba@knightarmco.com

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