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Thread: Why a stubby VFG?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by maximus83 View Post
    Rob, just out of curiosity, can you describe how your practice developed/changed and eventually led to "none"? I currently have none on 2 of my rifles (18" and 20" barrels), but last Fall added a stubby to my Sabre middy. So far I've had mixed results (some accuracy issues that were not there before), and am trying to figure out if I'd be better off going back to none, or if I need to buy a better quality or different type of VFG.
    Mine has more to do with ditching the rail entirely than anything else, and came out of spending a year with the AK. Not having one for 3 classes and 4k rounds made me realize that I really didn't need one. If I don't need a VFG, why do I need a rail? Wow, suddenly the gun is 8 oz. lighter and $300 cheaper!

  2. #12
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    Thanks Guys, those were exactly the answers I was looking for, while I'm here...

    Does your decision have anything to do with where you mount your light or vice versa?

    My right hand buddies mount the light on the left and use the VFG like many have stated here, but I see others (righties) who chicken hold the VFG and mount the light right side.

  3. #13
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    Heh, ive followed the same evolution as Rob.

    My first two classes were shot with rails. My third class was shot without rails and i ran into absolutely zero issues with recoil control.

    I think this evolution came about because i dont shoot well enough to see any benefit from a rail. I also dont shoot in situations where a free floated barrel would be noticeable, ie long distance.

    Having said that, vert grips CERTAINLY do hold a place in the stable of anyone thats actively shooting or training. They DO work if used correctly and can help many shooters drive the gun.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Mine has more to do with ditching the rail entirely than anything else, and came out of spending a year with the AK. Not having one for 3 classes and 4k rounds made me realize that I really didn't need one. If I don't need a VFG, why do I need a rail? Wow, suddenly the gun is 8 oz. lighter and $300 cheaper!
    BIG +1 to that!!! Most of the rail is not even used most of the time anyways and just covered up with, well, rail covers. Not having one also keeps me from buying more expensive little rail mounted trinkets and accessories (although I would like to see a cellphone holder/bottle opener/cigarrette lighter combo on an AR).

    No offense if you've got one, but AKs with rails just don't make any sense to me, especially if you've got a good LHG with the palmswells. That is also why I like the magpul MOE HGs; nice and meaty to hold on to.

    As for mounting a light, you could always stick it on the FSB with those little clamp/screw on rails, although it might make for a front heavy rifle until you get used to it. This actually brings up an idea that I had recently; if they could make a light that mounts on the bayo lug, I would definitely give it a try. It's not like the lug is used for anything else and it is within easy reach. Sound like a good idea?

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by M4Fundi View Post
    Does your decision have anything to do with where you mount your light or vice versa?
    They're very much related.

    I used to put my light at the 3, but that was hard to get at. I offset it from the bottom (around 4 or 5) and that was easier to hit, but still not ideal. About that time I came around to not wrapping my thumb around the VFG and the light went to 9 and eventually 11 as I choked up higher and higher on the VFG.

    Once I realized I had all this VFG that wasn't getting used, I switched to stubby grips.
    Principles matter.

  6. #16
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    Anyone with experience with the Troy VFG? That is what I have been leaning toward.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by M4Fundi View Post
    Anyone with experience with the Troy VFG? That is what I have been leaning toward.
    I haven't yet, but at first glance that head looks overly blocky.

    Troy on the left, Tango Down on the right. Notice the contour of the TD at the top, which is, IMHO, one of the reasons it's so popular. When you're using a high grip like gotM4 and MM pictured that contour really comes into play and the TD not only works great but isn't uncomfortable either.


  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Notice the contour of the TD at the top, which is, IMHO, one of the reasons it's so popular.
    back when the TD vert grip was under development, jeff cahill and i used to meet for lunch every couple of weeks or so as the 3D design company he was using was near my work. he showed me the SLA model of the grip which was more blocky up top, and after holding it, i said 'can you round the corners out more so it blends/transitions to the rail as much as possible?' the next prototype he showed me was the current design.

  9. #19
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    Was never a fan of vertical grips. Thought they where ugly and where an unneeded expense.

    BUT, I have practiced and competed nationally in Taekwondo for many years. My hands have taken a beating and found holding a traditional handguard caused pain in my wrist. Tried a TD stubby using a high grip allows me to control the rifle and allows me to angle my wrist less and not suffer from pain.

    I plan to put a stubby VFG in all in any AR I will ever own.

    I not into "doodads", just to have "doodads".... But in this case for me with my situation it's a beneficial "doodad".

    My first AR sports a quad rail, subsequent ARs do not. Sometime we get into adding all the "cool" stuff out there only later to realize we don't really need it and we've mainly accomplished adding weight.
    Last edited by RojasTKD; 07-02-09 at 13:00.

  10. #20
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    I'm all for those who want to try, test, evaluate, develop, vet the cool stuff (I like to), tho I want this build to be light short and fast... Buuuut I have the same problems in that "it ain't the years its the miles" and my beat up hands and wrists just don't enjoy horizontal as well as they once did and prefer to go vertical. Holding the magwell/forend is what I my hands "want" to do, but
    A) I would prefer my support hand further forward
    B) holding the magwell/forend type hold puts a finger in front of the e-port occasionally, so the VFG is gonna hopefully make all this work better for me.

    Part of (not all) the thought process of the Troy VFG was that I could do all the experimenting with short & long with one grip and get that decision worked out with out multiple buys for sided by side testing... and I'm still a checkered metal kind of guy ;-)

    I do agree that I have noticed the blockiness at the top of all the VFGs and wondered how that would affect the partial VFG/Forend hold that I expect to have.

    Great info thanks for your time and experience!
    Last edited by M4Fundi; 07-02-09 at 15:33.

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