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Thread: 'Stan question

  1. #11
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    A lot of units that aren't issued these things buy the stuff COTS (Commercial off the Shelf) with their pre-deployment money. I know we did. Of course, there are probably very few units who aren't kitted out by now.
    Hang up and drive.

    Luke 22:35-38

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBRFAN View Post
    Thank you but at what point are they modded?
    The rails/VFG's/optics are typically installed by unit armorers before the rifles are ever issued to the troops.

  3. #13
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    all the troops i saw while in iraq (06-07) had optics and all the ground pounders had rails and optics. mix of eotech, aimpoint, and acog's. i think the rails were mostly kac.

  4. #14
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    Thanks to all.Question answered.

  5. #15
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    Alot of the Comp M2's have been replaced with Comp M4's and alot of the PEQ2A's have been replaced with ATPIALs. The KAC rails and vert grip are still standard as well as Grip Pods.

  6. #16
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    Big Army - M4 MWS Carbine from Colt - comes with M4 RAS and Matech BIS
    Issued optic M68 CCO (in either M2, M3 or M4 versions)
    RFI optics, TA31 series of ACOG's, and EOTECH 552

    SOCOM - M4A1 comes from Colt with M4 RAS and 300m BIS
    Issued optic EOTECH 553, TA31DOC, ELCAN Spectre-DR
    Impact card optics - you name it, it will have been bought...

    Our M4 RAS Mil-pack comes with the vert grip and an assortment of rail panels
    Kevin S. Boland
    Manager, Federal Sales
    FN America, LLC
    Office: 703.288.3500 x181 | Mobile: 407-451-4544 | Fax: 703.288.4505
    www.fnhusa.com

  7. #17
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    Thanks Kevin;always good to hear from the horses mouth.

  8. #18
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    Before I left we got a new style rail for the M16s with M203's mounted, Ill try to find out who made it. Definitely wasnt the M5 RAS I used. In 06' before we deployed I received TA01NSN's and Comp M2 versions of the M68 CCO with gooseneck mounts. Since leaving Ive heard the unit replaced the M2's with M4's but the same M16A2 rifles remained.

  9. #19
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    I wrote up the MWS kits that are now making it into the MTOEs and RFI back in Dec, 2004 at Belvor. At that meeting the decision was made to pure fleet the BCTs with the M-4, recognizing that it would take a few years to make it happen. The position was pushed by the 10th MTN, 101st and 82nd. At the time only the 10th MTN had M-16;s in any sizable numbers.

    Over the course of about two hours I worked out three levels of kit, which after lots of massaging by DCD, TACOM, PICA and others basicly came out like the original proposal. 5 years later the info has been mostly applied to deploying units.

    That december draft was first breifed formaly to the best of my knowledge on or about 10 FEB, 2005 as the:
    "Rules of Allocation M4 & M249 Modular Weapon systemsand Night Vision Devices"

    The field requests Modular Weapons System Kits to meet oganizational and operational needs.

    The Rapid Field Initiative (RFI) program and unit purchases are meeting selected requirements.

    A need has been identified for the development of kits to allow more flexibility for the Warfighter & Combat Commanders.

    USAIC tasked to develop MWS Kit ROA’s for the IBCT, HBCT, CMD & Staff, and UEx.

    M4 offers the lethality, mounting surfaces, and maneuverability required in the close combat fight.

    Create three M-4 MWS Kits to fill different base line requirements.

    M4 MWS Kit ROA’s
    MWS-A
    Components: Rail System, CCO, PEQ-2/PAQ4, Tac Light, vertical grip, BUIS

    Assign to: (Deleted) in BCTs

    MWS-B
    Components: Rail System, ACOG, PEQ-2, Tac Light, vertical grip, BUIS, TWS-L, Bipod

    Assign to: (Deleted) in BCT CS/CSS.

    MWS-C
    Components: Rail System, CCO, BUIS

    Assign to: (Deleted) remaining CS/CSS
    We also worked out the rules that would allow the commanders and staff to recieve the M-4 and the M9 they were formerly documented for. Again the basic outline changed very little form the draft we developed.

    Issue:
    Field requests recoding selected command & staff positions personnel remarks to “16”, armed with pistol and rifle or carbine

    Discussion:
    Command & Staff personnel perform critical tasks requiring movement through hostile volatile areas of the theater. Pistols do not provide enough firepower to react to enemy contact.
    Missions places Command & Staff in role of “Ground Combat Soldier” without the proper weapon for the fight.
    The M4 MWS provides the level of lethality critical to survive in operating environments.

    Recommendation:
    Identify select positions without a rifle within the BCT staff and code those positions “16” armed with pistol and rifle or carbine.
    RFI also fields the SOPMOD stock to units, intended for the SDM's, but they go were ever the unit sees fit. There was also a funky bipod with "tooth" feet issued for awhile. The PEQ-15 is replacing many of the PEQ-2s and PAQ-4s. EoTechs were issued for a short time through RFI because Aimpoint could not make M-68's fast enough. I would imagine they will be completely replaced by Trijicons and Comp M-4s in the next couple of years.

    I wrote the appove as a freshly retired Infantry 1SG, just returned from OEF, based on what I believed to be common sense, within a set of rules that applied in that situation, and the feed back from the other two divisons reps. If I had to do it again I would most likely have redone the command and staff and disposed of some of those M-9s, perhaps giving the to the M-249 gunners. I also screwed up how the M-203's were documented because of the transition of the M-203 MWO for the M-4 rails into the M-203A1 and A2 models.

    So with all that in mind, KAC, Aimpoint, Insight, MaTech, Gripod, and who ever else benifited from this, can I have a cookie?

    Hopefuly that answered your question (without blowing my horn to hard) and since the contracts have all been let out............. and some of the specifics have changed since then, but you get the picture.
    Last edited by DMR; 07-14-09 at 22:50. Reason: deleted some detailed info, although common knowledge in some circles
    pro-patria.us

  10. #20
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    Never really seen anyone with an eotech in pictures. Anyone got any? This is a member's gun (on another gun forum) he's using the sandbox right now he just posted today.



    Last edited by Bowser; 07-14-09 at 23:11.

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