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Thread: Why I Bought It

  1. #1
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    Why I Bought It

    On July 1st, bkboooo posted a thread titled "Why'd You Buy It?". He said: I'm interested to hear short stories of why people chose to buy lesser-quality weapons- bush, DPMS, oly, RRA, etc..

    That thread is now 16 pages and more than 300 posts long. I've been lurking on M4C for several weeks now, and just joined the forum largely because of that thread. So, please give me some slack; this is my first (and perhaps last!) post.

    I only recently learned that it was possible to own a new AR15 in California. I have several handguns, a shotgun, and a Mini-14 SS ranch rifle. I intend to sell the Mini-14 when I have my AR in hand. I've purchased a California-legal off-list lower (OLL) and have ordered a CAR A4 rifle kit (AR4002 - 16" chrome-lined Wilson R-4 barrel, with RRA two-stage trigger kit) from Rock River Arms. I laid out $222 (including FFL, DROS, and CA tax) for the lower, and will pay $695 plus shipping for the RRA carbine kit. So, I'm in for about $950.

    It looks like a five or six month wait for the RRA kit...I'm not in a big hurry, but...

    I see my current options as staying the course for the RRA kit, or cancelling that order and buying a Tier 1 rifle piece-by-piece, at undoubtedly a higher outlay. I should add that I do want the two-stage trigger, and don't want to lose the OLL investment. What do I want the AR for? Range plinking (90% indoor at 25 yards), home defense, SHTF, and because I want an AR.

    Would appreciate your comments, advice, and specific recommendations...

    Vista

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vista View Post
    On July 1st, bkboooo posted a thread titled "Why'd You Buy It?". He said: I'm interested to hear short stories of why people chose to buy lesser-quality weapons- bush, DPMS, oly, RRA, etc..

    That thread is now 16 pages and more than 300 posts long. I've been lurking on M4C for several weeks now, and just joined the forum largely because of that thread. So, please give me some slack; this is my first (and perhaps last!) post.

    I only recently learned that it was possible to own a new AR15 in California. I have several handguns, a shotgun, and a Mini-14 SS ranch rifle. I intend to sell the Mini-14 when I have my AR in hand. I've purchased a California-legal off-list lower (OLL) and have ordered a CAR A4 rifle kit (AR4002 - 16" chrome-lined Wilson R-4 barrel, with RRA two-stage trigger kit) from Rock River Arms. I laid out $222 (including FFL, DROS, and CA tax) for the lower, and will pay $695 plus shipping for the RRA carbine kit. So, I'm in for about $950.

    It looks like a five or six month wait for the RRA kit...I'm not in a big hurry, but...

    I see my current options as staying the course for the RRA kit, or cancelling that order and buying a Tier 1 rifle piece-by-piece, at undoubtedly a higher outlay. I should add that I do want the two-stage trigger, and don't want to lose the OLL investment. What do I want the AR for? Range plinking (90% indoor at 25 yards), home defense, SHTF, and because I want an AR.

    Would appreciate your comments, advice, and specific recommendations...

    Vista
    I tier one set up should not really cost you more. I built an AR using an BCM upper and it ran me the same as you.

    If you have the lower, just get on Bravo Company USA's e-mail list for when there upper come in.

    BCM barreled upper = $475 (not currently in stock, but it won't be 6 months)
    BCM, G&R or DD BCG = $160ish (G&R tactical has DD BCG for $152 in stock now)
    Charging handle = $25
    Handguards = $25

    That's $685 plus shipping for a tier one upper and you'll be able to have it in you hands sooner than 6 months, probably MUCH sooner.

    Now I'm not saying RRA is total crap, just that BCM is a notch up, about the same cost and will be in you hands sooner.

    seem like a win... win... win all around.

    Good luck.
    Last edited by RojasTKD; 07-13-09 at 23:54.

  3. #3
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    Thumbs up

    first off, congrats on getting your first AR in enemy territory.


    i am of the mind that AR lowers are all the same, if they are forged and are in-spec. i bought a couple RRA stripped lowers and they are fine.

    the quality of LPKs (the lower parts kits that go into the lower receiver) can vary quite a bit from manufacturer to manufacturer...but the couple of RRA kits i've installed were better than i expected.


    i've heard some mixed things about the RRA 2-stage. on one hand, i've heard quite a few complaints about doubling with the RRA trigger. on the other hand, i've heard many people swear by the White Oak tuned RRA 2-stage.

    personally, i don't have any experience with that trigger....the only 2-stage i have is a Geiselle, so i don't have a verdict on the RRA one....just passing on what i've heard. but going on reputation alone, i would probably buy a LMT 2-stage over the RRA model.

    i'm not a big fan of 2-stage triggers in general. i don't think they belong on fighting rifles. however, since your AR will be Cali-legal and will have a bullet button installed, i doubt it will serve the role of a fighting rifle. since you'll probably just be using it as a range toy, i guess it doesn't matter so much.


    as far as the upper...yeah, i would cancel that order. don't feel like you're locked in or like you owe them your business, just because you placed an order with them.

    even before the election, RRA had quite long lead times on rifles. people would wait months for a special ordered RRA, when they could just buy a Colt, Sabre or LMT off the shelf for not too much more.

    granted, things are a little different now, since everything is a lot harder to come by and a bit more expensive....but yeah, i would still cancel the order for the upper.

    just get your RRA lower and then keep your eyes peeled for a deal on a quality upper like a BCM, Sabre, Noveske, LMT, etc...or get an upper custom built by Grant or Denny just the way you want it.

    just my $0.02. hope it was some help.
    Last edited by Parabellum9x19mm; 07-14-09 at 00:14.
    TUEBOR

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    I agree. I put together a BCM with Daniel Defense BCG for barely more than that, including a BUIS, in less than one month from start to finish.
    Last edited by Blob; 07-14-09 at 00:02.
    I like girl scout cookies.

  5. #5
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    90% of your shooting will be done at 25 yards and want a two-stage trigger? Are you that bad of a marksman? Even for the shots that will be at ranges of 300m or so, a single stage should be all that is needed. And two-stage triggers are typically not recommended for home defense SHTF guns. I would save that money or put it into buying BCM or DD instead of RRA. Regardless of what you end up building, kudos for getting around Cali's bullshit.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlatoCATM View Post
    90% of your shooting will be done at 25 yards and want a two-stage trigger? Are you that bad of a marksman? Even for the shots that will be at ranges of 300m or so, a single stage should be all that is needed. And two-stage triggers are typically not recommended for home defense SHTF guns. I would save that money or put it into buying BCM or DD instead of RRA. Regardless of what you end up building, kudos for getting around Cali's bullshit.
    True that.

    i missed the part about 90% of his shooting being at 25 yards and under.


    once you get your AR, you should really change your shooting habits and find a new blasting locale.

    the only time i've ever shot my ARs indoors is when i was zeroing my sights. i don't much like shooting indoors, period....but with ARs and similar rifles it just really not fun at all.

    plus with the benches they have in front of each lane, depending how its set up, it makes it hard to shoot from the kneeling position. and people look at you like you're insane if you go prone in an indoor range. "why's dat foo lyin` on the flo`? "

    and that brings me to the crowd who are drawn to indoor ranges. last time i was at an indoor range, zeroing my optic on an AR15, i overheard the guy on the lane next to me, say to his buddy "Yo, he gots an Aye-Kay".... his friend turned around to look at my "Aye-Kay" and in doing so swept me with his muzzle of his range-rental Cx4 Storm

    to get back on topic, the AR is capable of so much more than indoor plinking. if you just wanna plink indoors @ 25 - a pistol or .22 rifle would probably be better suited to the task. when you do get your AR, do yourself a favor and take it out to a place where you can use your weapon to its full extent.

    you'll be a better shooter for it and you'll get much more enjoyment out of your purchase.
    Last edited by Parabellum9x19mm; 07-14-09 at 00:38.
    TUEBOR

  7. #7
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    BCM all the way. For little to no more money than if you went the RRA route you have a kick-ass rifle that will do everything you need it to.

    BCM is quickly replacing a lot of kit that I had in the safe.
    Only hits count......you can not miss fast enough to catch up

  8. #8
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    Going with lesser quality parts makes even less sense in CA where you may literally only ever own one AR. If you're just going to have one, it makes sense to get the best quality possible (or, in this market, available).

    I'd second what everyone else said and get on the notification list for the Bravo Company 16" midlength upper. I'd also get on the list and add to that the Bravo Company bolt/carrier group.

    I'm not sure what kind of order you placed with Rock River, but truthfully their lower receiver internal parts are pretty good, if you ditch the two-stage. Another quality supplier of lower internal parts is CMT/Stag. You'll still need to add a stock and I'd suggest replacing the pistol grip with a Magpul MOE or an A1 grip, and add a gapper.

  9. #9
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    I second the idea of a BCM mid-length.

    I have both the BCM 16" carbine length and the mid-length. The mid-length has the fallowing advantages:

    1. Longer sight radius.
    2. Softer shooting with smoother and less felt recoil.
    3. Less heat in the chamber
    4. Less violent action for less wear and longer parts life.

    all that for no additional cost over a standard carbine gas system.

    Note: Saber Defense also make Mid-length uppers, though not always easy to locate one.

  10. #10
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    My first build ran me ~$850. Since then, the only parts still on it from that build is the barrelled upper and BCG

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