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Thread: KISS rifle Mandatory Upgrades/Mods

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by tylerw02 View Post
    *The hand guards are comfortable, but aren't long enough to feel natural and transition from target to target quickly---it feels as if I should be gripping the rifle under the front sight base. A DD FSP-style quad rail would give more versatility.


    -Daniel Defense Omega Rail or Lite Rail FSPM
    I'm sure you already realize this, but the part in blue doesn't really address the part in red unless you're using the Omega 12 that's on the DDM4.

    Something else to consider, depending on your experience with mid-length guns, is that the mid-length addresses the part in red all by itself for a lot of people.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlelebowski View Post
    Also, the more I think about it, the more I agree with Rob's concept as realized above.
    A lot of what I did with that gun, and the 6933 that I have kept conceptually similar, came out of spending a year with the AK and doing it "right". I shot my first matches and class with the only changes being comfort ones (different grip, extended safety w/ notch). I then was able to assess and address issues with the gun and potential accessories to add to the gun as I went. None of this was conscious, I just lucked into it and was able to identify it after the year was up and I found myself pushing past the wonder-rail ARs in the safe to grab the basic guns.

    Of course, truth be told if someone is really interested in "KISS", a good quality AK with light, RDS, and sling is probably a better answer than any AR.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    I'm sure you already realize this, but the part in blue doesn't really address the part in red unless you're using the Omega 12 that's on the DDM4.

    Something else to consider, depending on your experience with mid-length guns, is that the mid-length addresses the part in red all by itself for a lot of people.
    Precisely. If the two extra inches the middy offers over my 6920 cures it, I'll go with the standard 9.0 Omega. If not, I'll go with a 12.0 FSP style.

    Thanks for clearing that up. I should have stated that in my first post.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Of course, truth be told if someone is really interested in "KISS", a good quality AK with light, RDS, and sling is probably a better answer than any AR.
    I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you'd choose a 5.45 AK? Are you choosing the AK because of cost, mechanical simplicity, or reliability? Or perhaps an utter lack (compared to the AR) of addons?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Katar View Post
    This topic always gets on my nerves, but I'll attempt to remain dispassionate.

    There are two concepts involved here, and they are different:

    literal KISS

    KISS as a concept

    literal KISS = the notion that the rifle must be as basic and simple as possible. This usually winds up in the ultimate expression of a gun with A1 sights, a fixed stock, either no sling or a carry strap and no forward assist. This means the gun istself is as stripped down and as simple as possible.

    KISS as a concept = a rifle configured to make life simple for the end-user. I won't rehash what the previous posters listed, but all of those items (CCO, light, "tactical" sling) make life simpler for the end-user in a variety of situations.

    So, apples and oranges... you need to determine what "KISS" best suits your needs.

    Kinda like Church Tongue or Porn Tongue?

    To me KISS means basic and as a concept.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Katar View Post
    This topic always gets on my nerves, but I'll attempt to remain dispassionate.
    You don't say!

    Every time I see this topic come up, I think of The_Katar!

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlelebowski View Post
    I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you'd choose a 5.45 AK? Are you choosing the AK because of cost, mechanical simplicity, or reliability? Or perhaps an utter lack (compared to the AR) of addons?
    Right now I probably would at least give the 5.45 more of a look, but in general no. I like my AKs in 7.62x39 for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is availability of magazines and (current silliness aside) ammo. Not to mention there are American factory loads in brass for critical use and/or if importation was stopped.

    I don't believe that there is a reliability issue comparing an AR to an AK, given proper maintenance. That last part is the kicker. Part of the KISS idea, to me anyway, is also one of "set it, and forget it". I never once during that year cleaned the AK, and I never once gave a thought to whether or not I should lube it when I took it out of the safe. Other than a passing question when I started out, I also never toted a single spare part for the gun.

    And yes, cost is a big part of it, or should be. Unfortunately we have some current silliness in that department as well. An AK should cost under $500, and an AK that costs more than that starts to enter into the realm of questionable, and when they get up to being equal in cost to a quality AR they've lost all attraction entirely. But a $500 AK with an Aimpoint H-1 and Surefire G2 in Vltor offset light mount (maybe even one of the new throwlever ones so it's easier to get off the gun) on an Ultimak rail and a BFG Victory sling is pretty much the definition of "KISS" for me. If Larue's Irondot plays out well (never got a chance to run one myself) then that gets even more attractive at half the price and eliminating the need for the Ultimak.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    A lot of what I did with that gun, and the 6933 that I have kept conceptually similar, came out of spending a year with the AK and doing it "right". I shot my first matches and class with the only changes being comfort ones (different grip, extended safety w/ notch). I then was able to assess and address issues with the gun and potential accessories to add to the gun as I went. None of this was conscious, I just lucked into it and was able to identify it after the year was up and I found myself pushing past the wonder-rail ARs in the safe to grab the basic guns.

    Of course, truth be told if someone is really interested in "KISS", a good quality AK with light, RDS, and sling is probably a better answer than any AR.
    rob_s I am eagerly awaiting your new article. I have been reconsidering my original set-up LMT 14.5" upper with KAC ras hand gaurd . Arms 40# BUIS. I have a Larue LT-150 aimpoint mount and I am in the process of buying a aimpoint c-3 or ML3.
    What I am thinking about changing is swapping the Arms 40# BUIS to a Larue fixed BUIS and the KAC ras to standard handgaurd or a surefire m-500a HG light combo. But I am worried that my sight pic through the RDS and fixed BUIS might be cluttered. I have also read reports about how the m-500 has a short battery life does anybody make a LED conversion for the m-500?

  9. #19
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    Great thread. Classic M4c.

  10. #20
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    I don't like Ak's for KISS/SHTF as to me and million of others they shout FOE instead of friend.

    To me the simplest KISS is our (KAC) E3 bolt and bolt extension, as your not going to have much to do with it until you need a new barrel at 20-25k as whats more simple than a part that give 3x+ the lifespan...
    Kevin S. Boland
    Manager, Federal Sales
    FN America, LLC
    Office: 703.288.3500 x181 | Mobile: 407-451-4544 | Fax: 703.288.4505
    www.fnhusa.com

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