Followthrough discussion

[Heavy Metal]

I can tell anyone concerned, as someone who has taken several classes alongside JW777, that he, as a matter of routine, does a proper follow-thru, scan and assess.

I can assure anyone concerned that his skill at arms with firearms and with a handgun in particular, are far in excess of the average. He takes his handgunning skillset VERY seriously.

[John_Wayne777]

I can assure anyone concerned that his skill at arms with firearms and with a handgun in particular, are far in excess of the average.

I appreciate it, but you don't have to lie for me, bro.

[rob_s]

I can tell anyone concerned, as someone who has taken several classes alongside JW777, that he, as a matter of routine, does a proper follow-thru, scan and assess.

I can assure anyone concerned that his skill at arms with firearms and with a handgun in particular, are far in excess of the average. He takes his handgunning skillset VERY seriously.

and I don't think anyone is questioning that. In fact, I don't even think it's the point.

[Heavy Metal]

I appreciate it, but you don't have to lie for me, bro.

Well....when your right arm hasn't been severly injured. Funny thing, I hear central Virginia is currently undergoing a severe kleenex shortage. Coincidence?!?

[Heavy Metal]

and I don't think anyone is questioning that. In fact, I don't even think it's the point.

Point or no, stating it for the record does no harm.

[Derek_Connor]

Point or no, stating it for the record does no harm.

You going to send JW777 flowers later?

Good AAR. Throught provoking lessons to be considered...

[ToddG]

Wow, I go out of town for a weekend and this!

When I saw the caption (now removed) from the JW777 picture, I thought the exact same thing ... it was praising something that should not, in general, be praised.

However, we're confusing two different things here.

First, there is follow-through. Anyone who has ever played golf or baseball understands follow-through. You don't just stop at the moment of contact (or the moment of discharge, for a gun). For shooting, follow-through is verifying your shot via your front sight. Traditionally, it's taught as achieving a second sight picture. However, when you start working on speed, your follow-through is achieved through watching the sight lift in recoil. If it lifts from your aiming point -- if you don't see it dip, snatch, twist, etc. -- then you know you got a good hit.

Second, there is shot prep. This is the whole "get a second sight picture, finger on trigger, ready to fire another shot" thing. Saying you do that on every drill is silly. If you were shooting two rounds on each of three targets, how many sight pictures do you get on the first target, two or three? If you say three, you're going slow for no good reason.

Finally, regardless of the caption, it's ridiculous to assume there was no follow-through or even no prep during that drill. Ever see a photo with multiple pieces of brass in the air? Obviously, some people -- JW777 included -- can fire, follow-through, prep, and fire repeatedly in the time it takes a piece of brass to hit the ground. Logic tells us, then, that one could also fire, follow-through, prep, and not fire, finger off trigger, in the time it takes a piece of brass to hit the ground.

[Littlelebowski]

This reminds me of a pot on another forum where someone was actually criticizing Zak Smith for the position of his legs as he was running through a force on force class. Very hard to make an informed assessment unless you were there.

Another roger up for JW777's shooting ability, level of training, and practice of firearms safety.

[rob_s]

This reminds me of a pot on another forum where someone was actually criticizing Zak Smith for the position of his legs as he was running through a force on force class. Very hard to make an informed assessment unless you were there.

Another roger up for JW777's shooting ability, level of training, and practice of firearms safety.

Just because what looks like is happening isn't doesn't mean the still image can't be used as a discussion point.

[zushwa]

Just because what looks like is happening isn't doesn't mean the still image can't be used as a discussion point.

Definitely. I said in the beginning that it's just one photo of one drill, and that the caption as it read probably wasn't something to emphasize. Through 2 pages of this thread there has been some really good discussion.

I also don't care how good a shooter he is. I also qualified that with saying he probably is a much better shooter than me. The point of my comment was that if people are to look at a photo and have something specifically noted, there is potential for the untrained shooter to see it and pick up bad habits. Once a person is trained (as he obviously is) then the events that occurred can be quantified and processed, just like we've been doing.

Todd, I was kind of curious why it took so long to jump in. Thank you for your insight. Playing devils advocate, if you had a brand new shooter and you saw the same thing (finger straight along the slide before the brass drops) would you have any teaching points and what would they be??

I agree on how you teach the follow through and I understand that at speed the follow up sight picture is slow, if the sight picture is on the same target. To answer your question regarding shot prep, if I'm shooting 2 shots on multiple targets my "third" sight picture will be on the next target. My eyes will lead to the target and my sights will follow. Is that how you teach shooting multiple targets??

As I said, I'm in this for the information sharing. I'm not calling anyone out (as I've said several times) and I, for one, am getting a ton out of this thread. I think it says quite a bit about the shooter to have so many people rush to his defense and verify his abilities. For all of you that have EVER been to a class, has the instructor ever pointed something out (good or bad) that a student was doing as a discussion point?? That's all I'm trying to accomplish here.