Will you vaccinate yourself and/or your family?

Originally Posted by Alpha Sierra

Since I pay for my health care I will get my health care when I get the flu (swine or otherwise), whether or not I get vaccinated.

I pay for a service, I am damn well going to use it when I need it. Who are you to tell ME otherwise?

You may do so when you pay my health insurance permiums. Until then, STFU.

And no, not only I am not getting the H1N1 vaccine, I am not allowing anyone in my family to do so either.

If your paying health insurance premiums you are NOT paying the full cost of your medical care. The cost is spread out among those that pay premiums but don't collect benefits. AND you still use personnel time and supplies that could be have been used for those who took precautions even if you did pay the full cost. My opinion stands. But I'm not in charge so people who behave recklessly unfortunately will require the rest of us to pay.

Originally Posted by jman4427

I just have to ask...Did you not see any correlation there?

Ahh the old 'correlation equals causation argument'.

Last time it was raining hard here I saw a lot of people carrying umbrellas. Ergo, umbrellas cause rainfall

No, I never get flu shots, and I am not going to partake of them now either

My only concern is my 11 month old, but I dont trust the shot enough to allow that shit to be injected in his little body

but I have to ask - what exactly is so bad or risky about the vaccine?

In short, nothing. Unless you are allergic to eggs, or have had GBS in the past.

To whit:

http://www.quackcast.com/spodcasts/f...ue-entry-id-29

Now a lot of people will point to what happened in 1976 and say 'but but but'. Fact is, nobody knows why 500 people got GBS in 1976 (that's a rate of 1 in 100000 btw) It didn't happen before 76, nor has it happened since.

There is a lot of flat out bad information is this thread. I would suggest the following.

www.virology.ws

www.tviw.tv

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/

and http://www.quackcast.com

I have seen a LOT of people I know personally getting severly ill from the Flu in the last month. A lot.

This years vax is manufactured exactly the same way its been manufactured for the last 20 years, only the strain is different. In fact since they know what the strain IS and don't have to guess like the do with seasonal flu, the rate of efficacy should be higher. Its a good match to the circulating strain.

Several people raised questions earlier in the thread along the lines of 'how do you KNOW that it was the new H1N1' (in the absence of serological testing). Two things:

1. its way to early in the year for an outbreak of Seasonal Influenza
2. for the the people that have popped positive on a rapid test for Influenza A (H1N1 is the A subtype) that HAVE had serological testing done, around 95 percent of those tests have come back on PCR analysis as the new strain. So, if you get TRUE influenza this time of year, odds are highly likely that its the new strain.

I'd also like to point something out about the rapid test. Namely that its not very sensitive. What does that mean in actual practice? It means that if you test positive that you have the flu. It also means that if you test NEGATIVE, it does NOT mean that you do NOT have the flu. You can't draw any firm conclusion from a negative Rapid Test. It's a blunt instrument. The higher your viral load count the better it works, but a negative means nothing. At that point you have to rely on clinical judgement to decide if its really influenza or not, and perhaps subsequent PCR analysis.

BTW, Thimerosol is ethyl-mercury not METHYL mercury and Jenny McCarthy and Oprah aren't scientists. Well, at least Oprah isn't

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2009/1...nscience/all/1

Originally Posted by UrbanRunner

If your paying health insurance premiums you are NOT paying the full cost of your medical care. The cost is spread out among those that pay premiums but don't collect benefits. AND you still use personnel time and supplies that could be have been used for those who took precautions even if you did pay the full cost. My opinion stands. But I'm not in charge so people who behave recklessly unfortunately will require the rest of us to pay.

So what else about my life do you feel like controlling?

It is one thing for me to not get one, but not getting it for someone I am responsible for that is in the at risk group is irresponsible. I would hate to be a parent and have their child die, knowing they didnt get them the shot.

I stopped getting the regular flu shot because I felt like hell after it, and right now I count on my body being able to deal with getting the flu. If I was old, young, or had some disorder I would get it everytime.

I really dont know if vaccines works but I know I have not gotten measles, mumps, polio, or what ever other vaccines I got when I was a kid.

Originally Posted by variablebinary

No, I never get flu shots, and I am not going to partake of them now either

My only concern is my 11 month old, but I dont trust the shot enough to allow that shit to be injected in his little body

Let me guess, you never got the flu shot and have never got the flu, therefore ergo?

On the other side of the 'equation' my aunt has got the flu shot for the last 25 years and never got the flu. Nor did she get GBS, autism, retardation, the scabies, or suffer any other adverse effects. But I digress

What exactly do those two examples tell us about the efficacy and utility of the flu vaccine? Nothing.

What exactly are you concerns about your 11 year old? I am curious.

Originally Posted by JLM

Ahh the old 'correlation equals causation argument'.

Last time it was raining hard here I saw a lot of people carrying umbrellas. Ergo, umbrellas cause rainfall

First of all, I will admit that I made those comment on an emotional premise and not a logical one. I know that a sample of one can not make a definite conclusion. As for the correlation bit, I know I made it sound like the vaccine caused his illness and I know that is wrong but technically I never indicated the strength of the correlation. It could be weak or non existent which also doesn't mean there isn't a relationship at all. Who knows. There could be other variables that played into his situation that lead to his illness as well.

Also an error in the manufacturing process could have lead to improper inactivation of the virus which can result in a vaccine with infectious particles. This may have happened.

from first hand experience, I can tell you that the H1N1 flu really suxs. My wife is an RN and she received her shot; the other 6 of us in the house did not. She still got the full blown case along with the rest of us. Our 3 youngest are finally healthy enough to return to school but i'm having some concerns about that. They may be healthy (24 hours of no fever............also not using any fever reducing medication), but 4 of us in the house are still going through it, and I'm concerned about them possibly carrying the bug. From what we've read and heard from the doctor, if they pass that "24 hour" test, then they are okay. I have to go all the way back to the Philippines to remember a time when I felt this miserable.

hit the liquids hard, alternate tylenol and ibuprofen, sleep as much as possible, and don't watch the clock. Popsicles....lots and lots of popsicles. The only consolation is that now we've had it, supposedly we're immune for the rest of this year.

A question for the pro-flu shot people.

I believe vaccines work. I also think that the human body can adapt better by actually being exposed to something that has so many variations per year that science now can not keep up with.

Isnt it possible that the flu becomes stronger/mutates due to poorly made vaccines, improper distribution, and any other failure of the medical community?

Just like improper use of anti-biotics have caused mutations that are immune to drugs.