LSAT- the future of small arms

[wild_wild_wes]

Update!

LSAT PDF presentation from the 2010 Joint Armaments Conference, Exhibition & Firing Demonstration.

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2010armamen...riPhillips.pdf

This technology is going forward.

[MassMark]

I just love how some get hung up on what a weapon looks like. I could care less if it was the fugliest gun on the face of the earth, as long as it was reliable and had the potential for ending a threat and saving my 6. When and if this gun goes into production, there will likely be 4-pages on how the rollmark doesn't look right...

In the meantime, I hope this system comes to fruition if it is reliable, adaptable and aids the soldier in the field....

[wild_wild_wes]

What I think is intriguing is the graph showing the 6.5 Grendel performance vs. 5.56 & 7.62. I hope the Army will consider other calibers; it might lead to the "One Caliber" holy grail. But the main thrust of LSAT towards maximum weight reduction might preclude this, since 6.5 ammo would naturally be heavier than 5.56, even with the telescoped plastic or caseless cartridge iterations.

[Pumpkinheaver]

I have been hearing about caseless ammo machine guns and rifles for so long I'll believe it when I see one that works. Didn't the germans try it back in the 80's?

[Killjoy]

I have been hearing about caseless ammo machine guns and rifles for so long I'll believe it when I see one that works. Didn't the germans try it back in the 80's

They did, hence the comments about the "G-11"; H&K's aborted attempt into the new world of caseless ammunition.

Viola:

[Entropy]

Interesting. The question is, will it ever get any wide spread adoption. At this point it appears that the polymer cartridge would be the best option. The caseless cartridge has a laundry list of issues which H&K experienced in the G11 such as cookoff, exposure to elements, fragility, and just being a fire hazard.

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

It looks like they licensed the tech from HK. Hk actually had the guns sorted-out. The fall of the wall killed the whole thing. Hell, it damn near killed HK. HK makes nice stuff today, but they used to be crazy innovative. I am not saying that everything was magic, but they were one of the few outfits willing to spend the time working on new technology.

[HK51Fan]

I understand the need for weight reduction...anyone that has carried a full load out of kit does, but I sure as hope they test the hell out this stuff before they ever introduce it soldiers. I just don't see it passing the dummy test. I can see it being loaded backwards or least someone trying to.
Also I don't know how it will hold up long term for storage and such escpecially in extreme heat, cold, or moisture...you know the usual places they like to stick soldiers for long periods of time!! Lol...

[Entropy]

I understand the need for weight reduction...anyone that has carried a full load out of kit does, but I sure as hope they test the hell out this stuff before they ever introduce it soldiers. I just don't see it passing the dummy test. I can see it being loaded backwards or least someone trying to.
Also I don't know how it will hold up long term for storage and such escpecially in extreme heat, cold, or moisture...you know the usual places they like to stick soldiers for long periods of time!! Lol...

A modern polymer cartridge might actually resist the elements better than a metalic case. Polymer is an insulator, not a conductor of heat. Metal cases tend to conduct both heat and cold to the powder pretty well, causing either over pressure or under pressure issues after long term storage in extreme temperatures. If they use high quality polymer like you find in pistol frames, it will be more resistant to fire than a metal casing as well. I'm sure that if it goes into service it will be dummy tested and refined with time.

[wild_wild_wes]

Good point, Entropy. Besides, copper is a strategically important mineral; most armies have gone to steel cases to circumvent this. If you read the linked update PDF, it is noted that a wide variety of (currently non-ammo) manufacturers would be able to produce this cartridge.

As far as Greg Bells' point above about this being HK tech, I have to disagree. The LSAT swinging chamber/telescoped ammo is a completely different concept. If you have seen the G-11s operating mechanism, you would see a Teutonic clockwork nightmare in action. It was so complex that all the soldier was allowed to do was clean the bore....an armorer was needed to actually do any cleaning beyond that. The swinging chamber design is much simpler by comparison.