Opinion Journal item on student preparedness and value of a degree

[NMBigfoot02]

However, engineering graduate programs (EE for me) are a different world compared to the liberal arts programs, which are completely infected with leftists, statists, and other undesirables.

This. GA Tech ME here.

To quote from Caddyshack, "The world needs ditch diggers too!"

[EzGoingKev]

It is amazing how many people I know, usually younger folks, who meandered their way through a 2nd or 3rd rate college (and in some cases even grad school or a top school) who are dumber than rocks, write at a 2nd grade level, and now work menial jobs.

At the last few jobs I have the younger college kids I worked with really did not impress me at all. As previously mentioned, they could not even string together a complete sentence and was surprised at their total lack of knowledge about anything.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

There definitely is grade inflation and degree inflation. I have a Chemistry degree and went back for my MBA. In the intro Econ class I had to take, there were people struggling, that had just graduated from undergrad with business degrees. The class was nothing more than applied algebra, and these people had taken the class before and they couldn't get it. And this was at an accredited program, not some degree mill.

I think the real issue is that if you can get into a top tier school, it is going to pay off. It is the middle tier schools that cost almost as much, don't have near the marketability, contacts, or resources that are the bumb deal. Come out with 70% of the debt and 10% of the lifetime opportunities.

If you don't get into a top tier school, you're better off going to community or a state school and then trying to transfer in after sophmore year, after all the posers and legacy kids screw up and drop out.

[C4IGrant]

Grant had some excellent commentary in regards to this topic, if I can find the thread.

Universities, sadly, are businesses first and foremost.

I know too many people with degrees working for peanuts. Here in GA, just about anyone with a pulse can get a HOPE Scholarship, and with the decline in standards in High Schools, I do mean anyone with a pulse.

The only people from my sphere of HS buddies that made anything of themselves, had a positive, not negative, savings, are the ones who answered Uncle Sam's call.

Not sure if this is the thread or not: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=41408&page=4



C4

[C4IGrant]

Thanks for the compliment!

However, engineering graduate programs (EE for me) are a different world compared to the liberal arts programs, which are completely infected with leftists, statists, and other undesirables.

Agree.

I told my wife that if our two sons want to go to college, that is just fine by me, but there are rules.

Rule 1: NO LIB ARTS DEGREE!
Rule 2: NO DEGREE THAT YOU CANNOT ACTUALLY GET A JOB IN!
Rule 3: IF YOUR GRADES ARE NOT A "B" AVERAGE, YOUR DONE!

If they want some kind of "social underwater basket weaving degree" they can go ROTC and let the Govt pay for that crap.


C4

[C4IGrant]

Of my friends from HS, the ones that have made the most of themselves do not have any sort of degree. The ones with the $100K education are not doing ANYTHING in their major and make FAR less money than I do.



When I worked as a USAF contractor, I would sometimes have to work job fair's for the company I was with. I had guys with computer science degrees, engineering degrees and info system degrees all DESPERATE for a job. Then I had a lowly Navy enlisted guy that had C2 experience (GCCS) drop off his resume. He had about 2 years experience, a TS/SCI security clearance and NO college degree.

When I went back to the office, I handed over all the resumes with the ones that looked the best on top to my boss (retired USAF Colonel). He scanned through them all and tossed out ALL the people with college degrees. He reviewed the Navy guys resume and saw that he had high eval's and awards and told me to give him a call.

The guy ended up getting a job with us starting at $60+k a year and 3 weeks vacation.


My boss wanted someone that knew how to get things down and hit the ground running. This was 10 million times more valuable to him than the guys with degrees.


C4

[SethB]

I have a liberal arts degree. Political science.

I make $46,000 a year in my first job out from college.

Yes, I'm in the military.

I would also have gotten 65,000 in loan repayment, if I'd had any.

In the future, I intend to double down and get two Master's degrees, neither of which will ever pay for themselves.

Such is the cost of public service.

I wouldn't criticize all liberal arts degrees. Political science, history and philosophy are all very valuable. Philosophy, for instance, is the best preparation for law school that you can get.

[mattjmcd]

I have a liberal arts degree. Political science.

I make $46,000 a year in my first job out from college.

Yes, I'm in the military.

I would also have gotten 65,000 in loan repayment, if I'd had any.

In the future, I intend to double down and get two Master's degrees, neither of which will ever pay for themselves.

Such is the cost of public service.

I wouldn't criticize all liberal arts degrees. Political science, history and philosophy are all very valuable. Philosophy, for instance, is the best preparation for law school that you can get.

This is true, provided that you a) actually do go to law school and b) go to a good enough school AND do well enough to secure a large firm job or consulting gig that will make the financial outlay worth the effort. That speaks to the investment angle at least, but not to the education=wisdom disconnect to which Prager refers.

[Belmont31R]

A buddy of mine from HS got a degree from UCLA in philosophy. 20k something a year, and now he works for $12/hr at a bank in LA.




My dad does not have a degree but a few years of college. His company hired him without a degree, and has been working as an electrical engineer ever since. He is in Saudi right now making 300K+ a year + great benefits and bonuses.

[6933]

A college degree now, is what a HS diploma was 50 yrs. ago. Any job worth having now requires a transcript. Less than a 3.0 and applying for a good job? Won't happen.

In the real world a Masters today is what a Bachelors was 20 yrs. ago.

A college education for all? What BS. Not everyone is cut out for it AND that's ok. I know some talented blue collar guys that make more than many college grads; and have better job security.

F Obama. All he does is pander to anyone that will listen.