Trigger Control

[Sproggy]

Ive been shooting for a couple of years now and ive come a long way since i first picked up a gun. Ive put alot of work and alot of time into working on the fundamentals of marksmanship. Ive taken classes from LAV, Rob Pincus(thanks again), and Todd Jarrett. Im also a LEO who holds that highest honor for marksmanship that his department awards(which isnt really that impressive). That being said....my trigger control issues have got me ready to jump off of a tall building.

I use dummy rounds for ball and dummy drills constantly and I just cant seem to get past the anticipation. I also dry fire religiously and can perform a perfect press all day without ammo in the gun....but when the time comes to load up, I blow it. I put so much time into shooting that luckily Ive gotten pretty good at pulling the trigger quickly without seriously disturbing my sight alignment. But that isnt good enough for me anymore. When I put bullets into my gun its like i lose the ability to perform a slow smooth trigger press. It might start out slow, but it quickly deteriorates into some kind of mutant el snatcho press.
Im looking for ANY advice that you guys have got. Seriously..... Any reccomendations, vetted witchdoctors, or herbal supplements are welcome and greatly appreciated.

[Business_Casual]

I have the same problem, I think it comes from being a human and setting off an explosion right next to your head.

I can only recommend, as a fellow sufferer, that you A) continue with LAV and other tier one trainers that practice ball and dummy drills at classes B) use snap caps in your magazines at the range C) when you anticipate do remedial dry fire
D) Let me know if you come up with something that works better

Every trigger press is a chance to get it right. In my opinion, dry fire is better suited for specific manipulations like the press out, it has less benefit for anticipation because you know the gun is unloaded. You have to not know if it is a live round for there to be progress, I think.

M_P

[SPDGG]

You are not alone . . .

[Sproggy]

Good to know....but its still incredibly frustrating because its STUPID!!! I know the gun isnt going to hurt me when it goes off, and I know if I smoothly press the trigger straight to the rear then the bullet will go where im aiming. Yet I cant do it!

[Erik 1]

I found the info and responses in this thread very helpful.

[Sproggy]

Good link, thank you. Todd G mentioned "crushing trough the end of the press" in one of his posts in that thread. That is what I am doing. And when I try and go slower and hit a dummy round its like I spaz out and pull the sights off target or dip the gun because I know the boom is coming. Ridiculous.....

[ToddG]

Two points:

Ball & Dummy. Understand that B&D is for slow fire practice. If you're putting snap caps in all your mags while practicing rapid fire drills, you're going to think you're anticipating when you're not. There is a fine line between anticipation (bad) and post-ignition push (which is good). That fine line is indicated by the gun going *BANG*.

Trigger control is overrated. I know, it's heresy. But I regularly do a demo in which I slap the trigger as hard as humanly possible, bringing my trigger finger from all the way outside the trigger guard and smash through the trigger as quick and hard as I can. Normally, I hit within a few inches of my POA at 7yd. Why? Because if your sights are properly aligned, you have a strong 2-handed grip, and you don't anticipate the shot there really isn't an easy way for your trigger finger alone to overcome all the other muscles in your hands, arms, and chest that are keeping the gun on target.

Trigger control starts to matter when you're trying to be precise at speed up close (which I think is an important skill to have) or for longer-than-normal pistol distances (which I also think is an important skill to have). But anticipation and grip problems are the usual barriers to marksmanship for a lot of people.

[Sproggy]

Two points:

Ball & Dummy. Understand that B&D is for slow fire practice. If you're putting snap caps in all your mags while practicing rapid fire drills, you're going to think you're anticipating when you're not. There is a fine line between anticipation (bad) and post-ignition push (which is good). That fine line is indicated by the gun going *BANG*.

I only use ball and dummy drills for slow fire, and from what I can tell Im anticipating. I crush through the last bit of trigger press and cause the gun to dip.

Trigger control is overrated. I know, it's heresy. But I regularly do a demo in which I slap the trigger as hard as humanly possible, bringing my trigger finger from all the way outside the trigger guard and smash through the trigger as quick and hard as I can. Normally, I hit within a few inches of my POA at 7yd. Why? Because if your sights are properly aligned, you have a strong 2-handed grip, and you don't anticipate the shot there really isn't an easy way for your trigger finger alone to overcome all the other muscles in your hands, arms, and chest that are keeping the gun on target.

Trigger control starts to matter when you're trying to be precise at speed up close (which I think is an important skill to have) or for longer-than-normal pistol distances (which I also think is an important skill to have). But anticipation and grip problems are the usual barriers to marksmanship for a lot of people.

Im in agreement with you 100%. Like I said in my first post im actually a pretty good shooter considering my anticipation problem. I regularly shoot 3 inch groups at 7-10 yards while pressing the trigger quickly. And I can keep all m shots on Q target at 25 yards. Thats fine for PD quals, but not OK with me. LAV preaches 5-6 inch groups at 25 yards and that is my goal. I feel like in order to do that i need to be able to perform a slow perfect trigger press..... But I cant

EDIT: by the way im glad you showed up....Im seriously considering jumping into one of your upcoming classes in northern VA.

[ToddG]

Sproggy -- Here is what I'm hearing so far:

• You know what you're doing.
• You know what you're doing wrong.
• You know how to fix it.

All things considered, that's not a bad place to be. I'd simply recommend putting time into the B&D drill and little else until you're managing things the way you want. What gun, caliber, and ammo are you using?

You might also want to consider:

• B&D strong- and weak-hand only. The SHO/WHO drills tend to put folks in a less anticipatory mindset because they don't have an expectation of keeping the gun locked still in space as it goes off.
• Get better hearing protection, if possible. Folks with serious ingrained flinches are often sensitive to blast. If you're not doubling up (muffs + plugs) do so. If you're using low-NRR muffs with or without low-NRR plugs, upgrade to more protection.
• Try shooting some close bullseye targets with your eyes closed. I know, it sounds crazy. But closing your eyes will eliminate performance anxiety related to marksmanship and will also let you really focus your attention on how your hands and arms are moving as the trigger is about to break.

[geminidglocker]

I have trigger control issues with my Glock 26, I am definitly gonna' be following this thread. Takes a big man to admit he has a problem, especially in this subject.