APPLE iPAD announcement today

Originally Posted by SHIVAN

For the same reason Macs are not infested with viruses

So you don't understand the fundamental operating system level differences as to why OS X doesn't get viruses and you're one of those guys who think "as soon as Macs get popular, they'll get viruses?" Are you one of those people that don't realize that since OS X is POSIX compliant, that any virus that could effect it would effect the millions of POSIX compliant UNIX and Linux boxes in use in the corporate world?

I also note that you don't factor in ROI on Macs. I've rolled out Macs in the corporate world. It costs the company money to dick around with service packs, viruses, spyware, Office etc. When I rolled out Macs, that was that. They were gone. I'd see users with 70-80 days uptime.

Originally Posted by Littlelebowski

So you don't understand the fundamental operating system level differences as to why OS X doesn't get viruses and you're one of those guys who think "as soon as Macs get popular, they'll get viruses?" Are you one of those people that don't realize that since OS X is POSIX compliant, that any virus that could effect it would effect the millions of POSIX compliant UNIX and Linux boxes in use in the corporate world?

Posix compliance != binary compatability. There is plenty '0 nasty code to run on any unix variant. The flaws they exploit tend to be vendor specific.

Originally Posted by ToddG

Dude, we are clearly coming at this from two completely different universes.

Clearly, and mine is not solely from a user standpoint. Mine is from a system integration, systems planning, and maintenance background in a shop that runs Mac and Win boxes, that I bought.

Maybe some poor sorry bastard in IT will have to jump through a few hoops to make the Mac and Wintel boxes work nicely together. Good thing they get paid for their work.

Now you're actually "getting it". For most Mac users in the Windows business world, "just works" is code for I don't need to think about anything at all, someone else in IT figured it all out for me and my laptop "just works". Nevermind it took 240 man/hours to get it there, it's seemless and sweet as hell. It's cool, we're coming at stuff from a totally different angle.

Again, you keep coming down to "there might be someone in the building who can't use a Mac, so no one should use a Mac." It just doesn't follow.

The point, which for someone of your capacity should be clear, is that you can not set a MBP in front of everyone and say, "Here use this to do your AutoCAD, it just works." You'd be laughed at heartily since you are completely discounting that not everyone is as free and light as to only be burdened by webmail and a 21kb spreadsheet with straight tabular data. Fill in any of at least 50 programs I can think of that would fail without being massaged through Bootcamp, Fusion, Parallels, etc and even then it would be cludgy. Sure, it just works, but only with the assistance of a Win license. Wait, why did we buy a Mac again?

You say Apple has only 25% market saturation. That's double what it was just a few years ago, isn't it? You can pretend it's just a bunch of musicians and students but I travel a lot and see a lot of professionals whipping out MBPs on airplanes and in business meetings.

I am giving Apple the benefit of the doubt, as the number seems skewed in various publications -- so I called it 25%. It's probably lower, but higher than 5 years ago for sure.

Our CFO has a MBP, and he never uses the OSX boot. Never. Sad really as I bought him a really nice Mac on his request. Why? They're cool to have these days.

You don't have to buy a Mac, it's ok. You don't have to like Macs. But the people who just can't help themselves from coming into a discussion about Apple for no purpose other than the declare how bad/problematic/conformist Macs are...

You can stow your condescending attitude. I do formal analysis on what to buy and what fits all my users' needs. Two of my people use Macs, based on my analysis and purchase decision. If a Mac suited my needs analysis, I would have one. It would be top of the line, and it would actually do work a little more exciting than what I could accomplish on my old Treo 800W could do with an Office app plugin, and a BT keyboard.

I can only assume their brains have been warped by too much time spent repairing registries.

You keep mentioning registry issues, do you have some sort of PTSD regarding this very unlikely, for the average user, problem?? I can't say we've ever had to repair the registry on any of our machines in the last ten years. That's 60 machines, no registry repair whatsoever.

Hell, I can't even remember the last time Norton told me anything was going on with viruses either. Then again, I know what I'm doing and I make sure my stuff "just works".

Originally Posted by Littlelebowski

So you don't understand the fundamental operating system level differences as to why OS X doesn't get viruses and you're one of those guys who think "as soon as Macs get popular, they'll get viruses?" Are you one of those people that don't realize that since OS X is POSIX compliant, that any virus that could effect it would effect the millions of POSIX compliant UNIX and Linux boxes in use in the corporate world?

I understand root access on a passable level, and also understand that many of the Unix and Linux viruses/malware that have passed on are typically of not much consequence. The narrow window of operation, as well as specificity against exact implementations/versions of Linux/Unix/OSX make it a mostly fruitless effort with a lot of background work. planning and delivery.

A bigger wave of effects can be unleashed on the relatively simple Windows targets, with less work, and less specificity.

So not directly about popularity, but more about types of implementations of OSX machines and the smaller window of opportunity with much more, and harder work.

I also note that you don't factor in ROI on Macs. I've rolled out Macs in the corporate world. It costs the company money to dick around with service packs, viruses, spyware, Office etc. When I rolled out Macs, that was that. They were gone. I'd see users with 70-80 days uptime.

Most of these SP, virus updates, spyware monitoring processes are completely automated at our company. Configure it and forget it. Pushes data or scans individual computers, including files and email on many of our Linux servers.

Oddly, our Mac users help one another and keep a lot of their calls out of our formal helpdesk queues.

Helpdesk support is essentially a fixed cost, they get their salary, and they service whatever comes at them. OSX, Linux, Iphones, PDA's, Windows, proprietary, whatever. They don't break out our Enterprise Accounting system on a per case basis either. So no, no ROI on a Mac specific basis.

I'm guilty of a massive sidetrack to this thread, and feel badly about it. If anyone wants to start a new Apple vs. the world thread to discuss OSX, etc please feel free.






Utlimately, the Ipad will be a successful product and I might buy a 16gb one to go with my Touch and Iphone. I'm skeptical of the battery life, and will probably wait for the 2G.

I don't like it when mommy and daddy fight. /cry

Originally Posted by SHIVAN

Utlimately, the Ipad will be a successful product and I might buy a 16gb one to go with my Touch and Iphone. I'm skeptical of the battery life, and will probably wait for the 2G.

I would venture a guess that the battery life will be near the advertised level. The Macbook and Macbook Pros get pretty close to what they advertise right now, as does the iPhone.

Originally Posted by SHIVAN

You can stow your condescending attitude.

You wound me, sir, and I demand satisfaction! I suggest we meet at a time and place of mutual convenience for a test of skill to decide who is in the right. We will choose some random drill unfamiliar to either of us, such as this one, and we will both use a pistol which is unfamiliar to either of us, such as this one. Victor chooses the vanquished's next computer purchase.

Originally Posted by ToddG

You say Apple has only 25% market saturation. That's double what it was just a few years ago, isn't it? You can pretend it's just a bunch of musicians and students but I travel a lot and see a lot of professionals whipping out MBPs on airplanes and in business meetings.

***JW777 clicks out of the thread quickly hoping no one will notice that he's posting on a MBP....running Windoze 7.***

I would venture a guess that the battery life will be near the advertised level. The Macbook and Macbook Pros get pretty close to what they advertise right now, as does the iPhone

The battery in my MBP went Tango Uniform after a relatively short life, but I also tend to go through a lot of charge/discharge cycles. I also use Windoze 90+% of the time, and it doesn't do as good of a job at managing the battery as the default Mac OS. One of my big beefs with the iPhone is the lack of a replaceable battery. I like the option to replace if I deem it necessary, especially on a device that is kind of important in my daily life.

I also plan on getting the WIFI base model. I don't see much need for a larger one. I used my Iphone for quick internet searches at the gas station or restaurant. I see the Ipad as a replacement for what a lot of folks misuse their laptops to do.

The IPAD looks cool and I love Apple Products but I think I'd rather buy more ammo. My wife and I already have 2 Iphones, an iMac and a Macbook Pro...don't really see where this would fill a niche.