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Thread: Can you compare modern Islam to inquisition era Christianity?

  1. #21
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    Excerpt from Norman Friedman's article:
    The war for prestige is not like a war to gain concrete objectives, such as territory. Concessions are largely irrelevant except as a way of enhancing the prestige of whoever gains them. It would not, for example, matter very much to those involved that most Palestinians were much better off economically before the current war against the Israelis. the object is not to improve their lot. It is to prove that whoever damages the enemy is more fit to rule the Islamic world.

    Almost certainly we cannot remove from the Muslim world the sense of overall hostility that our enemies exploit for their own purposes. Even to abandon Israel completely would not solve the problem, although whichever Muslim leader could claim credit for its destruction would surely benefit. We can decide which Muslims leaders to back, although it is not clear that we can give them any measure of prestige sufficient to balance that gained by simply killing as many of us as possible, as in 9/11. We can hope to undermine the more dangerous leaders preferably by convincing their own populations that they are being led to mass suicide.

    We should, however, remember that we are suffering the side effects of a war within the Islamic world, not of a concentrated assault on us. Ultimately that war, like the Thirty Years War that followed the Reformation in Europe, is likely to exhaust the participants and lead to a more secular and tolerant view of the world. We have to ride out the storm first. That will mean propping up friendly regimes in enclaves, probably with access mainly by sea, and fighting off attempts to gain prestige by attacking us. Doing that will be a largely naval task, and it may well justify the deployment of sea-based ballistic-missile defense on a much larger scale than we currently imagine.
    Excepted from the April 2007 US Naval Institute Proceedings (pg 91).

    It looks like he shares your view to an extent. Although, he doesn't make a parallel to the Inquisition. Rather, he sees it as analogous to the Thirty Years War, where forces are vying for control of a religion.
    They had no right to win. Yet they did, and in doing so they changed the course of a war...even against the greatest of odds, there is something in the human spirit - a magic blend of skill, faith and valor - that can lift men from certain defeat to incredible victory.

  2. #22
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    Originally Posted by Anthony Jacob
    Has religion outlived its useful life? Is God a failed hypothesis? Has religion done more harm than good?
    God is NOT a hypothesis. He created you and me and all that you see and even what you cannot see in the spititual realm. 'Religion' has done a lot of harm. Look at Islam, that is religion. Atrocities done in the name of religion whether Judaism or Christianity are not the intention of the Bible. Although it is true that God told Joshua to go in and posess the land:

    And Joshua said, Hereby ye shall know that the living God [is] among you, and [that] he will without fail drive out from before you the Canaanites, and the Hittites, and the Hivites, and the Perizzites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Jebusites.

    ...but this was specifically God's intent to bring judgement on those pagan peoples. It was supposed to be a plan to eliminate the pagan practices so as not to influence the Israelites.

    Soooo, are you guys conservative “righties” simply because that is the Christian thing to be? Do you feel pressured into it because of your faith?
    It is true that many Christian evangelicals are "right wing conservatives' and have a political agenda. It is only so because we want to counter the socialist left with their secular humanism that seeks to eliminate the reality of God. All this has more to do with an expression of Christian values in our Christian nation and not have the left's godless values influence the people.

    I do not have a personal relationship with The Lord Jesus Christ.
    We are all sinners in need of a Savior, and this world will be beset by sin until the Lord returns to do away with it once and for all. If you do not see your need for a Savior who paid a debt that He did not owe for a debt that we could not pay, then I would say you are in serious error.

    Prov 14: NLT A mocker seeks wisdom and never finds it, but knowledge comes easily to those with understanding.
    "The war against this enemy is more than a military conflict. It is the decisive ideological struggle of the 21st century and the calling of our generation." George W. Bush

    Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Jacob View Post
    Where are all the damn groups that embrace
    science, reason and heed lessons learned from years past?
    ...and it continues.

    Funny....

    I hang around evangelicals all the time and they seem to be capable of reason and seem to be just fine on science. Like the cancer researcher who attends a church in my denomination....or the MD, or the economics professor....

    And darn it all if I have yet to hear anybody mention instituting a theocracy.

    Thus it would seem that in addition to not "liking" to blow up abortion clinics, Christians are capable of understanding math and science and using reason....even enough reason to figure out what the Constitution says. We can even go potty by ourselves! >:-|

    Perhaps if you actually spent time around actual conservative Christians rather than forming your opinions based on childhood perceptions and biased media presentations you could learn a thing or two.

    It is obvious by your posts that you have a serious problem with perception. Conservative Christians aren't trying to take away your guns, your money, your property, or your ability to say politically incorrect things. Conservative Christians today are no more inclined to institute a theocracy than the Conservative Christians who helped FOUND this nation and write our Constitution.

    Jerry Fallwell isn't standing up and telling people that the Constitution doesn't mean what it says. He isn't making speeches as a member of the Supreme Court saying that the court needs to increasingly look to "international precedent" to define the US Constitution.

    No, that was Ruth Bader Ginsburg, former ACLU bigwig who ended up on the Supreme court.

    In other words, you are living in fear of the wrong people. If I'm the boogey man hiding under your bed waiting to get you, then you have issues.

    If you happen to believe that the Constitution means what it says, conservative Christians are your best friends. Their determination has helped stem the tide of leftist nonsense that threatens to swallow our society....which is one of the reasons liberals spend so much time demonizing them.

    What I can't figure out is why people who ought to know better can't figure that out.

    Check your fire. Save your ammo for the REAL bad guys.

  4. #24
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    as a disclaimer I have not read all of the replies to the original poster...

    but one thing I find funny with his post, and some of the replies...


    the greatest fallacy in all of this is his association with radical islam with the muslim world as a whole...

    the MAJORITY of muslims are peaceful people...lets not forget that.....even in countries we consider "enemies"....i think if you ask the soldiers coming back from Iraq they will tell you this....

    The enemy is RADICAL islam sure...but its not Islam...or the entire muslim world...there are millions of muslims in this county today that are Americans, that love this country, and peace...and there are millions of muslims throughout the world that feel the same way...

    And in that way, I guess, your "average" Christian and your "average" muslim are not that different....

    Your "average" Christian wants to lead a "Christ-like" life...believes that by loving your neighbor and by doing unto others that humanity can be brought closer to God...now, I know that is an over-simplification of sorts, but please, tell me what Christ's greatest commandment was?

    I think you would find that your average muslim seeks to do the same thing...that belief in love, faith and charity brought into your life and shared with your neighbors and your community makes you stronger in your faith and brings you closer to Allah...again an oversimplification, but applicable for the purposes of my comparisons...

    my point is simply this..."good" muslims and christians alike are BOTH terrified when they see

    1) suicide bombers in Israel

    2) people bombing abortion clinincs

    why?

    because they both represent the radical elements of their faith gone severely awry...

    unfortunately for islam, radical islam has found state sponsors, money, etc...and, as such, is much more feared and well represented in the world...

    but, as an aside, if Country X decided to espouse radical Christianity and implement and sponsor terrorist attacks on any nation that allowed (abortions, gay rights, contraception, insert whatever here), so that it was widespread and no longer remote acts, would that be representative of me as a Christian? hell no....would I be offended if people began to group me in the same category? hell yes...

    And I think if you asked the "average" muslim, a lot of them feel the exact same way...

  5. #25
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    Last edited by baffle Stack; 06-18-12 at 23:52.

  6. #26
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    Where do I begin? Your questions are full of so much ignorance that there is almost no sane place to start. It embarrasses me that you claim to be a Roman Catholic, yet know so little of the history of the Church and the Spanish Inquisition. I am assuming that you get your information about the Inquisition from modern liberal sources. Please do some research on what the actual facts regarding the Inquisition and who it actually involved and why it was instituted.

    As to Islam, the first book the Jesuits had me read was Sword of the Prophet by Robert Goldston when I entered freshman year of high school about 24 years ago. The book is out of print, but you can find copies in libraries or on Amazon.com.

    I recommend that you learn the truth about Islam, which means surrender, not peace, and then come back with some questions.
    Affiliated with BattleComp Enterprises, LLC

  7. #27
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    And in that way, I guess, your "average" Christian and your "average" muslim are not that different....
    And I think if you asked the "average" muslim, a lot of them feel the exact same way...
    You do have a point about secular issues that very well may be true.

    Having read what the Koran teaches (Secrets of the Koran, Richardson) it "appears" to me that the radical Islamists are more like Mohammed than the typical Muslim, and those who are born again into new life in the Spirit are more aware with Spiritual discernment than the Christian who only goes to church.
    Last edited by Linea_de_Fuego; 04-09-07 at 02:34. Reason: spelling
    "The war against this enemy is more than a military conflict. It is the decisive ideological struggle of the 21st century and the calling of our generation." George W. Bush

    Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

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    Last edited by baffle Stack; 06-18-12 at 23:53.

  9. #29
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    Last edited by baffle Stack; 06-18-12 at 23:54.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Jacob View Post
    Sure until you ask for empirical proof of their deity, then they spout off nonsense like “faith” and “miracle”.
    Dude, if you don't believe, that's fine. But to call faith nonsense.... I haven't seen the "right wing Christians" attack you for your beliefs. Perhaps you need to look at why you enjoy poking at this and jabbing others. Trolling is ugly and you are not engaging in honest debate.

    Please go away.

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