Taking From Others W/O Permission

[Armati]

Two cents:

Survival is something you do when your plane crashes in the wilderness.

I think what we are talking about is disaster preparedness. In other words, be prepared on the front end. The idea is to weather the disaster, keep your wits, and return things to a normal state of civilization as soon as possible. The idea is not make your neighborhood look like NOLA during Katrina.

Now, in the event of TEOTWAWKI (total system collapse) well, all bets may be off at this point. Quite frankly, I don't think this has really happened in all of human history. Even during the Medieval years of the Plague, civilization and society did not collapse.

Most modern disasters last from 72hrs to 2 weeks on the outside. Pretty much everybody should prepare to live for two weeks with no outside help to include foraging/looting for basic necessities. Please note that a blue plastic tote full of 'Hinies' is rarely a basic necessity.

Beyond the two week point, I not sure anyone has an idea of how this will play out because I am not sure it has happened in the US in anyone's living memory. I am pretty sure you would be looking at cutting into that year supply of Nitro-Pak. If that is the case, it is also time to start planting food depending on the season.

For the most part, your long term survival strategy should prepare you to live a pre-electric 19th century existence.

If looting is part of your survival plan, you may want to look at a new plan.

[Jerm]

Two cents:

Survival is something you do when your plane crashes in the wilderness.

I think what we are talking about is disaster preparedness. In other words, be prepared on the front end. The idea is to weather the disaster, keep your wits, and return things to a normal state of civilization as soon as possible. The idea is not make your neighborhood look like NOLA during Katrina.

Now, in the event of TEOTWAWKI (total system collapse) well, all bets may be off at this point. Quite frankly, I don't think this has really happened in all of human history.Even during the Medieval years of the Plague, civilization and society did not collapse.
Most modern disasters last from 72hrs to 2 weeks on the outside. Pretty much everybody should prepare to live for two weeks with no outside help to include foraging/looting for basic necessities. Please note that a blue plastic tote full of 'Hinies' is rarely a basic necessity.

Beyond the two week point, I not sure anyone has an idea of how this will play out because I am not sure it has happened in the US in anyone's living memory.I am pretty sure you would be looking at cutting into that year supply of Nitro-Pak. If that is the case, it is also time to start planting food depending on the season.

For the most part, your long term survival strategy should prepare you to live a pre-electric 19th century existence.

If looting is part of your survival plan, you may want to look at a new plan.

Seriously?I can come up with a list if needed.If we're simply talking about regional events(which is all that matters if it's your region) I don't know if I have the time.I don't think the fact that "there's civilization somewhere out there" is going to be much comfort if you're not in it for a prolonged period of time/indefinitely.


By todays standards it didn't exist to begin with.

[Lee Indy]

and i guess what happened to Argentina was just a bad joke?

[Armati]

Ok guys, so give me a historical disaster situation that you think justifies abandoning civil order.

Third world countries like Somalia or Haiti really don't count because (I think) we are talking about actual real disaster preparedness here in the US (or elsewhere in the Western world).

A lot of SHTFers and TEOTWAWKI gang like to entertain fantasies of Zombie Apocalypse and Mad Max when there are plenty of real world examples to look at. Any strategy and planning should be informed by reasonable assumptions. Unless you live in a NORAD like compound (with a NORAD budget) you need to get real and prepare for things that might actually happen.

Argentina is interesting because it has always been a pretty developed country. What specifically are you talking about?

[Lee Indy]

here ya go.

http://www.silverbearcafe.com/private/10.08/tshtf1.html

[Jerm]

Sorry,I've been meaning for the last couple days to put together a bunch of examples with links etc.

...Just too busy(and lazy).

A simple Google search on "collapse of civilizations" should accomplish the same thing minus my filtering out what I would consider relevant to the discussion.

The most popular hits will obviously be Incan,Mayan,Roman,etc.But there are countless examples on various scales and with various causes.Including many modern/recent examples.

I guess the least I can do is link to the search.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&r...=&oq=&gs_rfai=

[tpd223]

It was called "The Dark Ages" for a reason.

Not that I don't get your point.

[Glock17JHP]

If the SHTF in my area, I would stay at home (where I belong) and protect my family and property. We would all work together. If you go and forage around off your property, you are on someone else's property. Expect to be shot.

[Mjolnir]

I think it wise (and accurate) that we, the savvy, will choose to SURVIVE first and foremost. I choose to do so with as small a "footprint" as possible meaning with as little begging, borrowing, stealing and fighting as possible. In other words, live like a fox, bobcat, leopard, ..., you get the point. To do so requires personal preparation otherwise you'll live (while you can) like a lion - stealing and quarreling like the majority have chosen. Keep God first and foremost and you'll be fine. Hungry and humiliated, perhaps, but fine.

[Spiffums]

If it is SHTF to the point where you are taking from others...... not borrowing or using because they aren't there but TAKING..... there is no leaving a note.

This is the point where you decide if your willing to eat human flesh to live.