Lone Survivor, the movie.

Originally Posted by Belloc

That thought crossed my mind as well when I watched that scene.

Me too

Originally Posted by Belloc

That thought crossed my mind as well when I watched that scene.

I've felt the same way when I read the book. A very similar situation compromised the mission of Bravo Two Zero in the first gulf War.

Originally Posted by Belloc

That thought crossed my mind as well when I watched that scene.

That's what I thought of when I read the book. I remember my brother talking to me about it as well, and saying something like "When you're compromised on a recon mission, I thought SOP was to abort? Not let your spotters go, then stay in the area."

Does anybody have any response to that?

POW-handling:
Should be adressed as part of Section 3 of the OPORD, Execution, in the sub-section called Coordinating Instructions -POW handling. Should not be something that is improvised if/when it happens during a mission, one should follow the plan.

You are obligated to bring POWs with you, or hand them over to MPs or other units, unless there are other factors that do not allow this. Then you can disarm them and let them go; the base principle is based on honor, and the released POWs are supposed to cease further fighting.

Recon elements will always face a dilemma with regards to this.

Actions on compromise:
This should be adressed as part of Section 3 of the OPORD, Execution, under the subsection called Coordinating Instructions - Abort Criteria.

Many different aspects must be adressed here. Soft compromise might have been on the Go-list. Soft compromise does not neccessarily mean that you must abort. Neither does contact with the enemy, if you are able to break contact.

Mission completion will always be the primary focus, but Abort criteria lists items that will help the commander to assess the likelyhood of mission success, thus knowing when to continue and when to abort; lost comms, casualties, compromise etc.

Originally Posted by Koshinn

When studying Operation Red Wings last year for some PME, one of the questions brought up was that of the ROE and the vote that LT Murphy called for regarding how to deal with the goat herders. Basically I was asked "what would you do and why?" and relating it to the ROE.

What I asked was "why did they even have a vote? it's the military, decisions are downward directed by the person in charge." Someone in the movie (I can't remember who) also mentioned that. Turns out, that whole event is somewhat controversial in that many believe it didn't happen at all.

I wonder if, in 20/20 hindsight, another option besides 1) kill them, 2) let them go, or 3) tie them up, could have been 4) take them with us as we exfiltrate until nightfall, then let them go.

Otherwise, very powerful movie.

It seems like goat herders are what geese and dogs were in Vietnam in that they acted as early warning for the enemy and were/are a real PITA. The geese and dogs could be dispatched however.

It's become a instant response now when reading any mil related book and seeing the term "goat herder" shows my heart sinks expecting the op to be compromised.

I don't care much for movies ,Hollywood garbage.

Didn't Marcus elaborate on this more in the book, or am I confusing it with my memory of him telling the story in person? Regardless, he's said that the issue wasn't taking the goat herders with them, it was the fact that they would in turn take the goats with them as well. The goats would follow the herders anywhere. If they tied I the herders up, that's where they'd stay and then people would come looking for their food when it went missing. If they took the goat herders with them to exfil, they'd be a four man element with three prisoners and a herd of braying animals with bells on their necks.

Originally Posted by Cylinder Head

Didn't Marcus elaborate on this more in the book, or am I confusing it with my memory of him telling the story in person? Regardless, he's said that the issue wasn't taking the goat herders with them, it was the fact that they would in turn take the goats with them as well. The goats would follow the herders anywhere. If they tied I the herders up, that's where they'd stay and then people would come looking for their food when it went missing. If they took the goat herders with them to exfil, they'd be a four man element with three prisoners and a herd of braying animals with bells on their necks.

That brings up an additional problem. If you separate the herder from the goat, a bunch of goats wondering around without any herders would likely draw attention too I'd think. I assume that too is something they have to take into account in making such decisions.

I saw the movie last night. My problem is (and it's with me), that I pay to much attention to details, to a fault sometimes....when I'm interested is something that is. My dad always said that if I paid half as much attention or gave a third the effort to my school work when I was a kid as I did to cars, trucks, atv's, dirt bikes, snowmobiles, guns and other stuff I was interested in, I could've gotten an academic scholarship. I don't know about that one dad. I just read both books. Finished Lone Survivor two weeks ago and I'm on the last chapter (#24 Links in the Chains) of Service now.

I'm not a book reader at all. I have to really be interested in something to read a book about it. So I've always heard that "the movie will be different then the book was". And I was surprised at how much different the two were. At first it seemed to be going the same way, until after the gunfight. Then it was a lot different then both books. Before the movie was released, everyone involved in making it made a huge deal as to how real it was and how Marcus was there to call BS when ever something wasn't right. It makes me wonder why Marcus let there be such a difference between the books and the movie. It was more then just differences to make it fit a certain time frame so it wasn't to long.

I'm not at all, in any way saying anything bad about the operation itself or anyone involved in it. I'm saying it was a let down for me because I was expecting to see a certain set of events and saw something different. In some cases a lot different.

NYH1.

I'll just leave this here.

http://hitthewoodline.com/patriotica...ivor-and-truth