S&B Short Dot Models Explained.

[SkiDevil]

Does it have the auto-off feature after 6 or 8 hours, as advertised?

Ironically, it is the 20mm objective model which ORIGINALLY surfaced with the "blue tint"...hmmm...
http://www.tucsonguns.com/Scopes-001_Schmidt_Bender.php

I have the S&B SD 1-4X 20mm, Locking Turrets, CQB reticle model [manufacture date 2006] and there is NO Blue tint.

Also, I can use the 'dot' at 200 yards and the eye box is very forgiving compared to other optics that I have used, including the Trijicon 1-4X TR24 scope.

As for the FFP, I actually prefer it for a ranging capability provided in this particular scope. I shoot my SD at 2X and 4X. Mostly 4 power, the majority of the time. I don't know if this model (SD II, CQB Reticle, 20mm) is still being produced but a phone call to U.S. S&B would provide an answer.

I was planning on providing a detailed review on my experience in the near future. I have been shooting mine at various ranges and under varying light conditions.

Regarding the dimensions:

The specs on the Midway website are wrong. Aparrently, the specifications for the LE model listed on S&B website are incorrect as well. The SWFA and this site http://www.eurooptic.com/schmidt-ben...iflescope.aspx provide the correct dimensions.

SD II CQB 20mm - Length= 268.5 mm or 10.57 Inches

SD LE Zeinth 24mm - Length= 289.81 or 11.41 Inches

Links:
SD II CQB Reticle
http://www.schmidtundbender.de/en/pr...-shortdot.html

LE SD
http://swfa.com/Schmidt-Bender-11-4x...ope-P8130.aspx


If there is a better optic for the intermediate range (0-400 yards) AR precision type rifle, I am still on the look-out.

The Leupold MK6 1-6X http://swfa.com/Leupold-1-6x20-Mark-...pe-P52981.aspx looks promising, however the more telling aspect for me will be the durability versus the SB construction. The few S&B scopes that I have examined and used all shared common traits; precise, robust, heavy, and well made.

It is a very significant investment, but either way you would likely not be disappointed.

Good luck on finding-one. The Short Dots are not easy to come-by these days.

SkiDevil

P.S. One of the great things about the CQB reticle is that it is possible to bracket the target inside of it providing for a very consistent hold. I have shot some tight groups with mine at 100 yards using this method.

[WS6]

I have the S&B SD 1-4X 20mm, Locking Turrets, CQB reticle model [manufacture date 2006] and there is NO Blue tint.

Also, I can use the 'dot' at 200 yards and the eye box is very forgiving compared to other optics that I have used, including the Trijicon 1-4X TR24 scope.

As for the FFP, I actually prefer it for a ranging capability provided in this particular scope. I shoot my SD at 2X and 4X. Mostly 4 power, the majority of the time. I don't know if this model (SD II, CQB Reticle, 20mm) is still being produced but a phone call to U.S. S&B would provide an answer.

I was planning on providing a detailed review on my experience in the near future. I have been shooting mine at various ranges and under varying light conditions.

Regarding the dimensions:

The specs on the Midway website are wrong. Aparrently, the specifications for the LE model listed on S&B website are incorrect as well. The SWFA and this site http://www.eurooptic.com/schmidt-ben...iflescope.aspx provide the correct dimensions.

SD II CQB 20mm - Length= 268.5 mm or 10.57 Inches

SD LE Zeinth 24mm - Length= 289.81 or 11.41 Inches

Links:
SD II CQB Reticle
http://www.schmidtundbender.de/en/pr...-shortdot.html

LE SD
http://swfa.com/Schmidt-Bender-11-4x...ope-P8130.aspx


If there is a better optic for the intermediate range (0-400 yards) AR precision type rifle, I am still on the look-out.

The Leupold MK6 1-6X http://swfa.com/Leupold-1-6x20-Mark-...pe-P52981.aspx looks promising, however the more telling aspect for me will be the durability versus the SB construction. The few S&B scopes that I have examined and used all shared common traits; precise, robust, heavy, and well made.

It is a very significant investment, but either way you would likely not be disappointed.

Good luck on finding-one. The Short Dots are not easy to come-by these days.

SkiDevil

P.S. One of the great things about the CQB reticle is that it is possible to bracket the target inside of it providing for a very consistent hold. I have shot some tight groups with mine at 100 yards using this method.

Thanks for accurate data! As to the FFP reticle you have, it is one that originally impressed me (albeit in pictures as I have not held one). When does it become usable/visible enough to use well, regarding magnification, without the illumination?

I did note, on your link to Euro Optic, that it appears to be the Zenith scope you have linked to, and not the Zenith PM II. As I understand it, the Zenith is a somewhat un-related product line that the PM II adopted the physical housing from?

[bp7178]

Also, I can use the 'dot' at 200 yards and the eye box is very forgiving compared to other optics that I have used, including the Trijicon 1-4X TR24 scope.

Regarding the dimensions:

The specs on the Midway website are wrong. Aparrently, the specifications for the LE model listed on S&B website are incorrect as well. The SWFA and this site http://www.eurooptic.com/schmidt-ben...iflescope.aspx provide the correct dimensions.

SD II CQB 20mm - Length= 268.5 mm or 10.57 Inches

SD LE Zeinth 24mm - Length= 289.81 or 11.41 Inches

I felt the opposite regarding the TR24, but we may not be comparing apples to apples. My Short Dot was a SFP with a P3 reticle.

The information you linked is not current. Again, the only accurate source i've seen is S&B's GERMAN website. The US one is incorrect (dated) as well.

The older generation SD LEs are 11.41", the newer ones are shorter and very similar in form to the FFP versions.

Zenith was the old nomenclature for the SFP version, it was derived from the Zenith line but when they went to the newest version they dropped the Zenith and list it as Short Dot LE.

This is what the new SFP version looks like...



Notice the length of the tube forward of the turrets. Slightly over an inch shorter than the previous SFP flavor.

[bp7178]

Does it have the auto-off feature after 6 or 8 hours, as advertised?

Ironically, it is the 20mm objective model which ORIGINALLY surfaced with the "blue tint"...hmmm...
http://www.tucsonguns.com/Scopes-001_Schmidt_Bender.php

That review is VERY dated and may have been something that changed during production improvements.

I never tested the auto off feature that I can recall. One of my frustrations with the scope was the steps of intensity for the dot. All of the settings below 7 IIRC aren't bright at all and are really meant for dark adapted vision in dark enviroments. You really have 4 levels of adjustment for use in daylight. I wish there was a middle ground to the low end of the daylight settings. Something that would have worked better in mixed lighting enviroments, ie city streets.

[Nick S]

Do you find the P3 reticle usable at 1X with no illumination?

And with the P3 when illuminated is it a small cross or Flashdot?

Thanks

Nick

[SkiDevil]

Thanks for accurate data! As to the FFP reticle you have, it is one that originally impressed me (albeit in pictures as I have not held one). When does it become usable/visible enough to use well, regarding magnification, without the illumination?

I did note, on your link to Euro Optic, that it appears to be the Zenith scope you have linked to, and not the Zenith PM II. As I understand it, the Zenith is a somewhat un-related product line that the PM II adopted the physical housing from?

The reticle is visible at 2X.

Although, I am by no means an expert on the Schmidt and Bender product line, my understanding is that the SD LE model is based from the hunting Flash Dot Zeinth model line.

I would suggest contacting SB USA or posing the question to Mr. Vickers on the SME forum. He could likely provide clarification and more technical information.

It can get somewhat confusing because of the several variations produced of the Short Dot. Also, if finding a Short Dot model to suit your needs is not possible, I would consider checking-out the Swaro 1-6X BRT model and the upcoming Leupold 1-6 as well.

However, if you decide on the Short Dot and have the time, I am fairly certain with some searching one could be found given several months if necessary. Particularly, if the SD 1-8 model is finally released coupled with other models coming onto the market such as the Leupold.

Link: http://vickerstactical.com/tactical-tips/short-dot/

[SkiDevil]

The information you linked is not current. Again, the only accurate source i've seen is S&B's GERMAN website. The US one is incorrect (dated) as well.

Thank you for the clarification. I was unaware of the recent change. Hence, the confusion I referred to in the other post.

Is the link/ website providing the most recent and accurate (correct) specifications, you are referring to listed at http://www.schmidtundbender.de/?

[bp7178]

Do you find the P3 reticle usable at 1X with no illumination?

And with the P3 when illuminated is it a small cross or Flashdot?

Thanks

Nick

The P3 was SFP, and very useable w/o the dot. The illumination was a dot, about 4.5 MOA on 1x, about 1 MOA on 4x.

The P3 SFP was nice in the regard if you knew your holds and understood it was different at 1x and 4x, the reticle is very versatile.

[M-FOURTEEN]

Oh how i wish could get an S&B.....The prices just go up year, after year. Truly wonderful products, i was in awe of the one i checked out this weekend.