America: Freedom to Fascism

[Snake RAH]

Here's something I found interesting:



We as a nation don't even spend a 1/10th of what we spend on Health and Human Services than we do for Homeland Security.

I don't know how many people have been to the Third World (and I'm not talking about Cozumel or Cancun), but our poor have nothing on their poor. This still is the United States, and it truly is a land of opportunity. We wouldn't have 20+ million illegals here if there was no work.

Besides, .gov is only good at collecting money, and generally doing the wrong things with it. We can't fix roads, have better conditions at VA hospitals, build levees or even seal the border. Why would I want to depend on .gov to pay for or handle my appendectomy?

[hatt]

I SURRENDER!, MY only concern is to get a situation where we, all Americans, have a health plan that we can get behind that takes care of what we need, medicine, health checks, bloodtest, Hospitalization and operations, hearing, vision and for left wing dudes, mentaL checks, because they reallly need it!

That health care plan is never going to be affordable. That would be like having car insurance that covered everything including oil change, tires, tune up, tear in the seat, the whole deal. Car payment $600/month- check, insurance $600/month-check.

[DIYTactical]

I've seen the video. Some of it was interesting some of it Tin Foil hat.

I personally prefer the Fair Tax. www.fairtax.org

The tax you pay is directly proportional to the lifestyle you want to live. So if you want those 24" rims or plasma TV your going to pay the tax when you buy it. You can't afford the Tax you probably shouldn't be laying down the cash.

[Business_Casual]

Do we really need border security? Think about it, if we didn't have benefits and hand-outs and politicians willing to look the other way while the agencies responsible for enforcing the immigration laws ignore the violations, would the illegals be streaming in here and getting jobs and having babies in our hospitals? I think not.

In my opinion, Border security is a top-to-bottom issue, not just a stupid fence that someone can dig under or around. The entire system is rotten to the core.

M_P

[Striker5]

In my opinion, Border security is a top-to-bottom issue, not just a stupid fence that someone can dig under or around. The entire system is rotten to the core.
mp

Amen! Any time you see a badrillion dollar technical solution it usually means someone doesn't have the balls to make a tough call. The wall is a waste of time, so is deporting illegals (unless we deported them to Liberia). Crush the people that hire them.

I spent two years renting apartments to the ruinously poor. After a while, I called them the "professional poor". Excepting the mentally ill bag people and single moms loaded down with kids, ANYONE can have it "ok". The several dozen people I rubbed shoulders with were completely comfortable with being uninsured, reckless, violent, sexually incontinent, welfare bums. Why get a job at Taco Bell or Autozone when you can lay around all day asking each other for cigarettes?

The untreated crazies and the single moms (up to a point) have my sympathy as I have seen their miserable seemingly hopeless lives first hand. EVERYONE else can swing in the wind and don't deserve a single penny of our money.

The Left pats itself on the back for helping the dispossesd when in reality we have created three generations of motivationally crippled losers.

I'll just sit down now...

[hatt]

The Left pats itself on the back for helping the dispossesd when in reality we have created three generations of motivationally crippled losers.

I'll just sit down now...

The Left's plan has been masterful. They now have a large base of persons who will vote exclusively on the foundation of what someone says they will give them. Here is the problem; the Right is now the same way, except they are unable to out-Left the Left. Sensible people no longer have any sort of voice in DC but will surely go along with the Republicans for the foreseeable future further adding to lack of a voice. I haven’t seen anyone I support; it’s pretty much trying to pick the one isn’t going to be the worst. How far can that get you?

[sproc]

I personally prefer the Fair Tax. www.fairtax.org

The Fair Tax, or any national sales tax, may be worse than the income tax. They would make it the government's business to know about everything you buy, which is a much bigger invasion of your privacy than them knowing about everything you earn. Even worse, as soon as they can set a different tax rate based on the item being purchased, they will tax guns and ammo out of existence. Read this from JPFO: http://jpfo.org/fairtax.htm.

This thread is talking about three problems: taxes/tax preparation, illegal immigration, and health care costs. They all have the same root cause: socialism/welfare state.

Fix that cause (i.e., eliminate the nanny state), and the others evaporate:

Taxes: We would need neither an income tax nor a sales tax; other sources of revenue (tariffs, use fees, etc.) would cover the rest.

Immigration: Without social programs, people would immigrate here primarily for the American dream: free market opportunities. We want these people. And even if we still saw a large number of immigrants, they'd no longer be harming us by being net-negative (i.e., use of social programs exceeding their contribution to the economy).

Health care: The problem is not that health care insurance is expensive, but rather than health care itself is expensive. If health care weren't so expensive, our need for insurance would nearly disappear. Most people would still need insurance for the worst case scenario (car crash, cancer, etc.) but we'd just pay out of pocket for normal doctor visits -- like it used to be in America. And the catastrophic insurance would be much cheaper than the full-spectrum insurance we have today. So why is health care (and insurance) so expensive? A large part is government meddling and the resulting abuse of its programs. A merchant tries to give an individual a good deal, just enough to be profitable. But when that same merchant knows the government or insurance company is paying, he charges a lot more. In addition, he incurs huge costs just dealing with these government programs, regulation, etc. Health care needs LESS government, not more.

One more thought: Let's not let our desire to keep our money cause us to give up our freedom and privacy, which are worth far more. Heck, I'd pay MORE in taxes if they'd just leave me the hell alone.

[pogostick]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=0

The link above is for the full video, just in case anybody was wanting to check it out.

[hatt]

The Fair Tax, or any national sales tax, may be worse than the income tax. They would make it the government's business to know about everything you buy, which is a much bigger invasion of your privacy than them knowing about everything you earn. Even worse, as soon as they can set a different tax rate based on the item being purchased, they will tax guns and ammo out of existence. Read this from JPFO: http://jpfo.org/fairtax.htm.

The fairtax is never debated by opponents on how it is written now but always on the "what ifs" that could be enacted down the road by .gov. I would like to see anything pass the "what if" test. By this method a piece of legislation that would vacate all firearms laws would be opposed on the grounds that one day the wording could be changed and ban all guns.

I suggest the Fairtax book by Boortz; all profits are donated.

[sproc]

History tells us laws almost always slide toward bad "what if's." We might as well start calling them "when's" not "if's." So the choice is not between an intrusive income tax and a hopefully-benign sales tax; it is between an intrusive income tax and an intrusive sales tax. I still think the sales tax is too dangerous. Does anybody honestly think the government won't use it to discourage "incorrect" behavior?

On the other hand, people I respect are for it. And I suppose even if it only took a few years for it to turn evil, we'd at least have those few years of bliss. But I truly fear what would happen after that.

I might even give that book a try. Maybe there is a way to do this thing the right way.