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Thread: Lubrication Issues

  1. #51
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    To help with oil flowing into the reciever extension tube while in storage you could try the old muzzleloading tip of standing the rifle muzzle down. And I will appologize in advance if you all feel this is absurd statement from a 2 time poster, but it does help keep the breech plug dry, so in theory it should work for m700m's comment.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by R Moran View Post
    My issued gun spends alot of time in the rack, in teh NM heat, for this reason I use TW25.

    Another officer at work claimes shes(yes she) never had a problem with Hoppes gun oil. I tried to get her to understand thats because, she cleans the gun, oils it, and it sits, drys out, etc. She then lubes it on the range, shes never had to fire it 2 or 3 months after the last maintenance she pulled on it, w/o re-lubing first, like in a gunfight. Her level officer does not shoot alot to begin with either.

    Bob

    Just out of curiosity, what is the maintenance protocol for a patrol officer? Does their carbine sit in the trunk for weeks in between scheduled maint/re-lubing? Is it up to the individual officer to maintain commonly shared weapons (shotguns, carbines) that never really leave the vehicle?

    I can easily understand how it would be the individual officer's responsibility to maintain their sidearm, but how does all the other shared "junk in the trunk" get maintained? Any experience about how long things can go before lubes evaporate and effectivenss is lost?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmart View Post
    Just out of curiosity, what is the maintenance protocol for a patrol officer? Does their carbine sit in the trunk for weeks in between scheduled maint/re-lubing?
    It better not.

    Is it up to the individual officer to maintain commonly shared weapons (shotguns, carbines) that never really leave the vehicle? ...I can easily understand how it would be the individual officer's responsibility to maintain their sidearm, but how does all the other shared "junk in the trunk" get maintained? Any experience about how long things can go before lubes evaporate and effectivenss is lost?
    Weekly inspection/dusting/relubing by the officer. Monthly and unannounced inspections by the armorer. Detailed inspections 2x annually or so.

    Shotguns live in the cars. Rifles/carbines have to come out at night.

    If they're not found wet, they get relubed. It seems to be needed every couple of weeks or so. If they didn't get relubed, they would still run through a basic load.
    2012 National Zumba Endurance Champion
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  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by C4IGrant View Post
    Did anyone every think about the fact that you cannot clean, lubricate and preserve well all at the same time?
    I've made similar comments over the years to people who still swear by CLP. I try to explain that it'll do an okay job at all three things, but not really excel at any of them. I like to use what I call the "Swiss Army knife analogy." Something that is designed to do more than one job usually doesn't do any of those jobs as well as a dedicated tool does; meaning that the blade on a Swiss Army knife doesn't work as well for most tasks as a regular knife, the screwdrivers don't work as well as a regular screwdriver will, nor do the scissors or the saw or just about any of the tools. It is, however, convenient to have all of those tools together in one item. But when you really need a knife for a job, you want to have a real knife; and if you're going to be putting screws in holes all day you want a proper screwdriver. My point is that CLP might be fine for an afternoon of plinking or shooting cans, but if you're going to be running a gun hard and getting it hot and dirty, then you'd be wise to choose a dedicated lube that can hold up; and you'll need a better cleaner when the day is through.

    As an aside, I long ago dated a girl who was a hairdresser and she had a similar little rant about products claiming to be a "shampoo and conditioner in one" and how the two do completely different (and diametrically opposite) things, so it's ludicrous to think that you could combine them. It's sort of like trying to put paint and paint stripper in one can. I guess people are just looking for convenience and don't really stop think about the details of how the properties that make a good cleaner run counter to those that make a good lube, and asking one little bottle to do everything for your gun probably isn't the wisest decision.

    In my limited experience, I had no complaints with TW25B or Militec, but I recently made the switch to Slip 2000 and have been converted. The fact that it works so well, and that it's non-toxic and doesn't stink, frankly amazes me. I'd like to thank Pat, Grant and the other guys here for "turning me on" to it.

    Derek
    An evil soul wields an evil sword.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by R Moran View Post
    My issued gun spends alot of time in the rack, in teh NM heat, for this reason I use TW25. After watching Paul Howe slather it on, I think I'll be alright.

    It stays put, but is not so thick as to cause problems. I alos keep a small bottle of Militec or Slip2000 in the vest. If I'm on the range, I can always add alittle wet lube.
    I've been using TW25B on my carry pistols for years, but I've never used a grease on my AR, just wet lubes.

    How much do you use? Do you put it in the same places where a wet lube is necessary? Are there places you really need it, and some places you don't want it?

    Thanks!

  6. #56
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    Tiger Seven- great analogy!
    There is noting in CLP that makes me feel warm and fuzzy- that is, it cleans like crap, and it lubes like crap. I wasn't interested in the preservation angle if the rest was a show stopper.
    Several years ago the Army's Preventative Maintenance magazine (the PM "comic book") stated that you should no longer use CLP for cleaning as "it promotes carbon".

    Apparently this makes it just LP.....

    Unsure why it only promotes carbon while being used as a cleaner and not as a lubricant, but this is apparently similar to that ammunition then decides to expand based on sensing heat

    I haven't seen any further reference to that, and CLP is still in the TM's.

    A while back i worked for a unit that was strongly dissatisfied with CLP. They had the good fortune to bump into Greg Conner of Slip 2000 at a trade show.
    The got rid of the CLP and went to Slip.

    Me- i sent 3 gallons of CLP to the recycle facility several years ago.

  7. #57
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    I always thought the point of CLP/Breakfree, was to give "Joe" one thing to use, take to the feild, etc. Instead of having to take RBC and LSA, etc. The CLP just simplified things. It may not have been the perfect answer, but it was a thought. And, has been said, used properly and enough, just about anyhting will work.

    Jmart,
    Our org. is alittle different. Every weapon gets cleaned at teh range after firing. They have about 5 auto parts cleaners for this. They're lubed w/ whatever the range has there, usually BreakFree.
    All weapons, are drawn at the beginning of shift, and turned in at the end. When you draw your weapon and clear it/load it, you are to inspect it, IE make sure the light works and the Aimpoint or CQ/T works, etc.
    There is a cleaning room at the admin buliding's, and anyone can go 10-6 have a supervisor clear them, and use the room. This when I put the TW25 on( I don't use the CLP).

    I just use a "acid" brush and coat teh entire BCG with it, brush a little down on the lower parts, and some on the buffer and spring. We don't have much trouble with rust, but I'll put some spray TW25 on a rag, or whatever else is around, and wipe down the steel parts.

    Bob

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by R Moran View Post
    I just use a "acid" brush and coat teh entire BCG with it, brush a little down on the lower parts, and some on the buffer and spring. We don't have much trouble with rust, but I'll put some spray TW25 on a rag, or whatever else is around, and wipe down the steel parts.
    Thanks!

    When you say you spray the TW25, are you referring to the liquid version (as sold by KleenBore; Mil-COMM call it something else)?

    I'm interested for my "truck gun." It sits for long periods of time in a case and rarely gets shot, so I'm thinking TW25B might be a good idea for it.

    Thanks again!
    Last edited by rhino; 07-27-07 at 18:46. Reason: Corrected brand name

  9. #59
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    Thanks. I had no idea that weapons were turned in and checked out like that. being a civilian I just assumed stuff lived in the trunk and every couple of weeks it was someone's duty to relube it.

    Regarding the CLP, there are different ratios of "C" and "L" and "P" in each brand. Also within a brand, there have been revisions to the formulations over the years to address each area, but when you add some of "L", it may come at the expense of "C" or "P" and vice versa. BTW, SLIP2000 is labeled a CLP although many think of it as just a lube.

    I've got about 5 different items on my cleaning shelf so I can't say I've committed to just one product. For the bore it's either FP-10 or some Butch's Bore Shine followed by FP-10, or FP-10 followed by Sweets followed by FP10. For the BCG and everything else it Mil Comm 25 Degreaser followed by SLIP2000 Carbon Cutter/Shotgun Choke Tube Cleaner (they're the exact same product accordng to SLIP) followed by TW25B.

    When I run out of all this stuff I might just switch to SLIP EWL or regular SLIP2000 CLP. But I still think an occasional dose of a copper buster down the bore is warranted, every 500 rounds or so.

  10. #60
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    I believe they market it as LCP
    Same issue. I use it as a Lube. I use the 725 as a cleaner.

    Note that Bob's place of employment is sufficiently different from what most cop agencies are. Guns may get less or more care as dictated by Those Who Know Better.

    At my old address, gate guards had shotguns safety wired into the racks, so that the action / magazine could never be checked.
    Wanna guess how much love these Wincheters got?

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