"drop free" magazine/mag well capability doesn't make sense.

[rob_s]

So why not train to ALWAYS pull the mag out with your support hand and not rely on gravity to do it for you?

Some people DO train that way. Many of them also train to use the charging handle to release the bolt for similar reasons.

I prefer to engage my brain, and do what this guy does.

I depress the mag release while simultaneously grabbing a mag and bring it up. If the mag hasn't dropped free for whatever reason I will pull it out and insert the new one.

It's not rocket surgery.

[dbrowne1]

.............

[HuttoAg96]

I don't have any of the experience that you guys have, but when I was practicing doing some of the things shown in the Magpul video, the process of rolling the gun over 90 degrees counter-clockwise to check the chamber (to confirm stoppage was due to an empty mag) and then rotating it ~ 180 degrees clockwise while pressing the magazine eject causes my pmags to pretty much fly out of my weapon. It appears that is done while simultaneously reaching for a fresh magazine.

[NCPatrolAR]

My arguement was simple, because sometimes the magazine will not eject all the way and will hang in the mag well due to the angle the rifle is being held, it's easier to train to always grab, rip out, and toss the magazine for the sake of consistency.

You can do that if you want however you need to recognize that you are slowing yourself down for no good reason. Its that whole training for something that might occur thing that I spoke about earlier.

[ForTehNguyen]

why wouldnt you want it to drop free, thats extra steps eliminated. If the mag is flying out Im already reaching for the next mag instead of reaching for the empty mag to remove.

We can make the same argument for drop free mags on pistols, why need it there? Its obvious why its needed on pistols

[titsonritz]

I would never consider owning a weapon that was not drop free. The first thing I did to my Hi-power was convert it to be drop free. Mag retention is very secondary to rapid reload capability in my book. If I’m still alive after the lead stops flying then I’ll worry about the $10-15 mag.

[RogerinTPA]

I believe his point was not mag retention, it was not depending on your mags to drop free. Of course, I have never been through an EAG course, and am only working on memory, so I could be wrong. Will look for the post where Pat discusses it on another site.

The class I took last Dec, we dropped mags for three days, except when we practiced Tactical reloads with retention. Pat's philosophy is you should never run your weapon dry (Emergency Reload). He teaches reloading is a "planned" event. Reload when there is a lull in the fight to keep the weapon topped off. The retained mags, still have ammo and could save your life, and consolidate ammo if the opportunity presents itself. I found myself doing that very thing to top off partial mags.

[rob_s]

I was in that class with Roger, and have trained with Pat 3-4 times before that and will again this December.

Roger has it exactly right re: Pat's reloads. He is constantly harping on people to keep the guns topped up, other than when we're running drills like the Modified Navy Qual (5 standing, 5 kneeling, 5 prone w/ reload between). Pat trains people to always keep the guns topped up. Better to have a full gun than a partially full gun.

This has NOTHING to do with the speed, or emergency reload. When the magazine is empty you press the button to eject it from the gun with the right trigger finger while the left hand reaches for the fresh magazine. If there is still a magazine in the magwell when your fresh mag gets to the gun you use your left hand to grasp the empty mag and strip it from the gun while holding on to the fresh mag, and then insert the fresh mag.

[rob_s]

You can do that if you want however you need to recognize that you are slowing yourself down for no good reason. Its that whole training for something that might occur thing that I spoke about earlier.

While I agree with you, there is still that other side to the coin. I don't think the guys that train for what might happen are wrong, just different. I look at training to strip the mag as similar to training to run the charging handle, or training with the pistol to grasp the slide instead of the slide release. It's not the way I do it but I understand those that do and I think that, situation depending, there are reasons to train for those things and in some cases I could see an argument for training that way.

However, whether you train for a 100% solution or a 99% solution, you need to have a plan and the skills to deal with the unexpected. There's a difference between unexpected and unplanned for. I EXPECT my magazine to leave the gun on it's own when I press the magazine release but I have a PLAN for what to do if it doesn't.

[NCPatrolAR]

While I agree with you, there is still that other side to the coin. I don't think the guys that train for what might happen are wrong, just different. I look at training to strip the mag as similar to training to run the charging handle, or training with the pistol to grasp the slide instead of the slide release. It's not the way I do it but I understand those that do and I think that, situation depending, there are reasons to train for those things and in some cases I could see an argument for training that way.

However, whether you train for a 100% solution or a 99% solution, you need to have a plan and the skills to deal with the unexpected. There's a difference between unexpected and unplanned for. I EXPECT my magazine to leave the gun on it's own when I press the magazine release but I have a PLAN for what to do if it doesn't.

That's why I didn't say it was wrong to do it; just inefficient.