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Thread: AAR: Vickers Tactical 3-Day Advanced Combat Handgun Class–Oct 22-24, 2010–Moyock,NC

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    AAR: Vickers Tactical 3-Day Advanced Combat Handgun Class–Oct 22-24, 2010–Moyock,NC

    This class was quite simply the most "perfect storm" that I’ve experienced so far in firearms training.

    Larry, who's always excellent, was on his absolute “A” game, the level of student proficiency was phenomenal, the facility allowed us to go the next level, and the weather was nearly perfect.

    I've been to a fair amount of firearms and tactical training, both governmental and private, over the last 12 years or so. I've shot with most of the big name instructors and at quite a few of the big name schools. Additionally, I've taught several successful classes and served as an AI for dozens more. With that as a bit of background, I can say that this was unquestionably the best shooting class that I've ever attended.

    The range at USTC (aka Blackwater) was fully covered and featured both pop-up steel plates and numerous lateral movers. The covered range and pleasant weather let everyone comfortably learn without being unduly exhausted by the normal Virginia/North Carolina heat and humidity that we are generally used too. Not being exhausted from the environment let everyone stay on their A game and gain the most possible knowledge out of the class.

    I've been good friends and shooting buddies with Larry for just shy of 10 years now so you could expect me to be a bit biased. That's understandable but I can tell you with absolute honesty that this was the single best class that I've attended anywhere and with anyone for all of the reasons listed.

    The other great thing about this class was the level of shooter proficiency and professionalism. In every formal firearms training I've attended over the last 12 years, I've always ranked number 1 or 2 in the class. I was only middle-to upper middle of the pack in this class. I was shooting just fine and about at my normal level but a lot of the other shooters were leaving me well behind. Larry and I both agreed that this was the best shooting class we've ever seen. It was a very humbling experience and that's a good thing. As one shooter said, paraphrasing, "you rise to the level of the tide". The tide was unbelievably high in this class and it forced us all to work hard to rise to that level vs being with a weaker group of shooters and being able to rest on one's laurels.

    Speaking of shooter skill, there were several guys in the class whom I had previously taught in one of my classes or whom I had AI’d in a previous Vickers class. The level of skill and progress made by these guys over the last few years was amazing. They weren't just getting better, they had become outstanding shooters. The real stand-out for me was our own Paul Hotaling. When I met Paul 5 or 6 years ago he was a boringly average shooter with some really bad habits. I hadn't shot with Paul in well over a year and I was blown away by his shooting ability. Paul hadn't become a better shooter, he'd become an absolute hammer. He's been worshiping at the alter of accuracy for the last 5 years and he's been rewarded duly---he's become unbelievably accurate and fast. Nice.

    All paper shooting was done on the USTC targets featuring a set of stacked B8 bull’s-eyes and this was used to reinforce Larry's mantra of "accuracy first". Off all the hundreds of shots on paper, I only dropped 3 or 4 outside of the 8 ring but every shot outside of the black 9 ring was painful and embarrassing. As a point of reference, every shot except for those 3 or 4 shots in the 7 ring would have landed squarely inside the 8" -0 zone of an IDPA target but the accuracy standard here was either the 3.5" 10 ring or the 5.5" 9 ring (aka "inside the black"). Any rounds out in the 8" 8 ring (aka "outside of the black") were considered unacceptable and the ground for personal shame. This stringent focus on precision is one of the key factors that sets Larry's training philosophy apart from most other instructors and schools who often preach that just getting your rounds into the upper torso with most of them being in the 8" circle is good enough. Despite the stringent accuracy standards, the shooting was anything but slow. I saw the vast majority of the class shooting just as fast as I've seen other students shoot in other classes and schools except here their rounds were destined for that 5.5" 9 ring not "somewhere" on the paper or steel. Fast and accurate is way more important than fast and so-so.

    We also had the pleasure of shooting on USTCs 12x12" steel movers from 5-25 yards, both static and while shooting on the move. The ability to shoot fast and accurately on the steel movers was really gravy on top of this already phenomenal class. Shooting while on the move at the steel movers is about as realistic as training can get with live ammunition on a square range. Also, when you see students shooting 6 for 6 or 12 for 12 with a service pistol on a rapidly moving target at 15 and 25 yards, you know that the instructor is doing something right. The same can be said for many of the students who shot cleaning time and time again shooting the steel movers while moving forwards and to the rear from 12 to 6 yards and them back again. All of those high concentration rounds on those tiny 5.5" black circles were paying off big time.

    The obligatory round count for those who care was just shy of 1200 rounds for me. And every single one of those 1200 rounds was fired with purpose, care, and learning vs just being thrown down range.

    And as a final note, Larry live fire demonstrated almost every drill to the class and shot many of the timed tests with us. If an instructor isn't willing to demonstrate what he preaches live fire in front of the class, I have very little interest in hearing what they have to say. You have to practice what you preach if you want the congregation to take you seriously.

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    AWESOME Class. This was one of the greatest concentration of excellent shooters I have shot with to date. I cannot say enough for the skill level of every single man (even if they are laser inkjet repair men) that was on this line.

    Now I swear to God on all things Holy , if Grey Group, LAV, or someone doesn't come up with a "TEAM SPONGEBOB, **** YEA!!!!" T-shirt, I will. That is just too good to pass up. Oh how they would sell.

    The TEAM AMERICA movie poster on a Tshirt, except with Spongebob, the caddy-shack gopher/groundhog (sorry Paul), a fumbling painter, a jail bird, and a man holding a printer all geared up. This has all sorts of WIN.

    Thanks to everyone who made this happen. I don't want to sound like a fanboy in saying this, but it is really hard to describe his classes and not. I have trained under a good many of the trainers out there today, some great and some not so great. The one thing that keeps me coming back to LAV is this; He's like a movie like Snatch, O'Brother Where Art Thou...... etc, every time you attend, you pick up something new. Even if it is the same material, there are little things that you miss sometimes, and when presented again you will pick up. A constant flow of mini-lightbulb moments if you will. Training with Larry is very much like peeling an onion, there are many layers; and only through taking in a few classes under him (and others to gain a perspective of reference) do you really begin to get a grasp on how much the man actually knows and how gifted he is in being able to "present" that knowledge to even those as slow as myself.

    I wished I could show you guys how bad I sucked with a handgun 5 years ago and what I can do now just by applying what he has taught me. It's not about being a super human (although I am convinced there were some in this class that are just that, hell there was even a superhuman painter there,...sorry Dave), it's about applying the same fundamentals, making the same sequence of events happen over and over, time and time again that make you great. A lot of people have a hard time grasping that concept. Larry drives this concept home very well.
    Last edited by Hootiewho; 10-25-10 at 11:02.

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    Very cool and congrats to Dinger! Good on your brother!



    C4

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    "Team Laser Jet Printer Repair.

    Big bucks, big tits, big action!"

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    So you met some pretty switched on printer repairmen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by orionz06 View Post
    So you met some pretty switched on printer repairmen?
    Dude, we were some pretty switched on printer repairmen.

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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Hootiewho View Post
    The one thing that keeps me coming back to LAV is this; He's like a movie like Snatch, O'Brother Where Art Thou...... etc, every time you attend, you pick up something new. Even if it is the same material, there are little things that you miss sometimes, and when presented again you will pick up. A constant flow of mini-lightbulb moments if you will. Training with Larry is very much like peeling an onion, there are many layers; and only through taking in a few classes under him (and others to gain a perspective of reference) do you really begin to get a grasp on how much the man actually knows and how gifted he is in being able to "present" that knowledge to even those as slow as myself.
    Funny, I was just thinking that very same thought myself. I couldn't agree with you more.

    There is a hardly a wasted word that pops out of Larry's mouth. Sometimes, I wish I had a damn tape recorder and a post-class transcription services.
    Doing my part to keep malls safe

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    Vickers Tactical
    www.vickerstactical.com



    Grey Group Training:
    www.greygrouptraining.com



    U.S. Training Center
    www.ustraining.com

    The 1st of the photos;





















    Paul A. Hotaling
    Alias Training & Security Services, LLC
    Paul@aliastraining.com
    757-215-1959 (Mon-Fri 8AM-5PM)
    757-985-9586 (After Hours)
    www.aliastraining.com


  9. #9
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    Vickers Tactical
    www.vickerstactical.com



    Grey Group Training:
    www.greygrouptraining.com



    U.S. Training Center
    www.ustraining.com






















    Paul A. Hotaling
    Alias Training & Security Services, LLC
    Paul@aliastraining.com
    757-215-1959 (Mon-Fri 8AM-5PM)
    757-985-9586 (After Hours)
    www.aliastraining.com


  10. #10
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    Dave,

    Your AAR is not making me feel better about having to miss this weekend's class.......now, where is my Drano Cocktail?

    I am most sorry you got to miss me sans Serpa now, doin' the ALS thing!
    Last edited by Heavy Metal; 10-25-10 at 16:54.
    My brother saw Deliverance and bought a Bow. I saw Deliverance and bought an AR-15.

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