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Thread: What are your thoughts on this open carry video?

  1. #41
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    This guy is a complete idiot:

    1. He needs massive amounts of training regarding how to hold himself, talk with and to police, and about what is and isn't legal before he gets himself beat, shot, or in a lot of trouble.

    2. While it is legitimate to record certain police events, and to set up organizations that monitor police when a department has proven to be breaking the law, it is not really justified in the case of traffic stops.

    3. He actually lied in the video proving that he's an idiot, that wasn't his girlfriend he was filming, and it made him look a lot worse and a lot more threatening by saying it was.

    What a tool. If this is what the "right" calls activism I'm amazed.
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  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mac5.56 View Post
    What a tool. If this is what the "right" calls activism I'm amazed.
    No. A lot of people on the right and gunowners in general regard it as stupidity for reasons already detailed in this thread.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed L. View Post
    No. A lot of people on the right and gunowners in general regard it as stupidity for reasons already detailed in this thread.
    Notice the quotations... Then read some of the comments on the video itself to see how many people think this guy is friggen awesome!
    Last edited by Mac5.56; 11-23-10 at 17:31.
    Mobocracy is alive and well in America.*
    *Supporting Evidence for Hypothesis: The Internet
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    'All of my firearms have 4 military features, a barrel, a trigger, a hammer, and a stock."
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  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by 500grains View Post
    1. It should be legal to video, record or photograph in any public place, whether it is a traffic stop, TSA search or whatever.

    2. There is no need to get close and provoke the police or distract the police so that they may be placed in danger.

    3. That cop in uniform is a douche.

    Pretty much.

    On one hand I applaud the guy for taking a stance for rights. On the other hand it is an antagonist approach which simply fuels the "us vs. them" mentality between law abiding citizens and law enforcement.

    Sometimes law enforcement has to be forced to respect rights, but if we can do it an a better way that is the preferred option.
    It's hard to be a ACLU hating, philosophically Libertarian, socially liberal, fiscally conservative, scientifically grounded, agnostic, porn admiring gun owner who believes in self determination.

    Chuck, we miss ya man.

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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mac5.56 View Post
    Notice the quotations... Then read some of the comments on the video itself to see how many people think this guy is friggen awesome!
    There's a lot of morons, and a lot of folks that are a might confused.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jake'sDad View Post
    Uhhh no, and no.

    Stopping a guy with a gun, acting strange and approaching a cop in the street on a traffic stop, was more that enough PC to stop the guy.
    Totally agreed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jake'sDad View Post
    And unless I missed it, (I was multi-tasking), they didn't detain him.
    Well they did, it is called a Terry stop, and with a terry stop they dont have to restrain someone, but they did not push it since they let him leave.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jake'sDad View Post
    Cops could have handled it differently, (disarming the guy and patting him down could have easily been justified, clearly neither cop splits atoms in their spare time), but they were absolutely right to try and check the guy out.
    Again, agreed

    Quote Originally Posted by 500grains View Post
    Probable cause does not mean you think the guy is annoying, don't like how he looks, etc.
    Actually in some cases it can, it all depends on your experience and the circumstances at hand. This is not always the case but it can be. As for the vid, both parties could have done better but both also did well in some ways(it could have went very bad), but all in all the guy with the camera was a moron, but at least he know his rights which is more than many.
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  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas View Post
    Well they did, it is called a Terry stop, and with a terry stop they dont have to restrain someone, but they did not push it since they let him leave.
    Understood. It was certainly a stop, but didn't rise above a Terry stop.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abraxas View Post
    Actually in some cases it can, it all depends on your experience and the circumstances at hand. .
    The facts and circumstances must cause you to have a reasonable belief that a crime has occurred to establish probable cause. In a state where open carry of a firearm is legal, and where video taping events which occur in public and w/o any expectation of privacy, can anyone here identify the CRIME which the uniform policeman had a reasonable belief that the video kid had committed? I can't put the facts and circumstances together to establish reasonable belief, or even remote suspicion that a crime had occurred.

    What is the crime that there is a reasonable belief of? Anyone and everyone can field this one. The quote above is not intended to direct the question.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by 500grains View Post
    The facts and circumstances must cause you to have a reasonable belief that a crime has occurred or is about to occur, to establish probable cause.
    You forgot that part. A good example of this is the case where we get, not only the name Terry stop, but our case law to back it Terry v. Ohio. If you will notice that no crime had yet been committed yet he does stop them based on odd behavior. So again yes you can make a Terry stop based on the odd actions and looks if you want to, but you had better be able to articulate why. http://supreme.justia.com/us/392/1/case.html Here is a summary:

    "A Cleveland detective (McFadden), on a downtown beat which he had been patrolling for many years, observed two strangers (petitioner and another man, Chilton) on a street corner. He saw them proceed alternately back and forth along an identical route, pausing to stare in the same store window, which they did for a total of about 24 times. Each completion of the route was followed by a conference between the two on a corner, at one of which they were joined by a third man (Katz) who left swiftly. Suspecting the two men of "casing a job, a stick-up," the officer followed them and saw them rejoin the third man a couple of blocks away in front of a store. The officer approached the three, identified himself as a policeman, and asked their names. The men "mumbled something," whereupon McFadden spun petitioner around, patted down his outside clothing, and found in his overcoat pocket, but was unable to remove, a pistol. The officer ordered the three into the store. He removed petitioner's overcoat, took out a revolver, and ordered the three to face the wall with their hands raised. He patted down the outer clothing of Chilton and Katz and seized a revolver from Chilton's outside overcoat pocket. He did not put his hands under the outer garments of Katz (since he discovered nothing in his pat-down which might have been a weapon), or under petitioner's or Chilton's outer garments until he felt the guns. The three were taken to the police station. Petitioner and Chilton were charged with carrying"


    P.S.-- Also what causes "reasonable belief"to you is not the same as someone who is in law enforcement . They see very different from the rest of the public because they see a lot more than the rest of public of certain things
    Last edited by Abraxas; 11-23-10 at 21:22.
    "Intelligence is not the ability to regurgitate information. It is the ability to make sound decisions on a consistent basis "--me

    "Just remember, when you are talking to the average person, you are talking to a television set"--RDJB

    One Big Ass Mistake America

  10. #50
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    Hope they come to Florida. You must present ID. If you refuse, you go to jail.

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