#00 spread at room distance

[Backstop]

Personally - but nothing personal JodyH - if my shotgun and ammo patterned like that, I would not use it for home defense.

Why?

What if the only shot I had was a head shot?

At 12yds with that pattern, what would the chances be of me scoring a fight stopper to his noggin?

There's no telling what the intruder will present for me to shoot.

For that reason, my primary HD gun is a carbine.

No point in listing the advantages, as they're well known.

AFWIW, I have a 590 with a modified choke, and shoot Fed LE132 or Fed LE127 in it. The 132 gives me about fist sized groups at 12 yds - or pretty close to that. Been a while.

[ST911]

The Win mil 00B produces a poor pattern, typical of other non-premium commercial 00B offerings. The comparison to the super-X has already been made.

With controlled patterning loads widely available, there's little need to consider the others anymore.

[terrymo]

Federal Flight Control or Hornady Tap is what I would recommend for personal defense with a shotgun. The configuration of these two types of ammunition all but eliminates the need for barrel modifications.

[jklaughrey]

Change ammo asap and go to flight control or tap. Also be aware a shotgun is never capable of doing the job of a rifle, but a rifle can do the job of a shotgun. We have SBS in our patrol vehicles gathering dust. Weapon that is deployed by choice is the AR. This is a hint.

Although, less than lethal duty is by far better served by a shotgun.

[JodyH]

Personally - but nothing personal JodyH - if my shotgun and ammo patterned like that, I would not use it for home defense.

Why?

What if the only shot I had was a head shot?

Ahhh... the old head shot/hostage shot argument.
Honestly, how many people here are 100% confident to pull off a headshot on a badguy when your 3 year old child's head is right next to your target?
Hostage headshots aren't going to be like they are on the range. The badguy isn't just going to stand there are let you carefully take a bead on his noggin. You hostage isn't going to be completely still either.
Hell most people screw up a hostage shot as many times as they make it on the range after a good warmup and with careful aiming.

As to a straight headshot without a hostage.
Again we're back to the 4" pattern vs. the 10" pattern on a small moving target.

A shotgun can either be a shotgun or it can be a really shitty excuse for a rifle.
If you're going to chase ultra tight patterns why shoot buckshot at all? Why not run a slug?

[JodyH]

Federal Flight Control or Hornady Tap is what I would recommend for personal defense with a shotgun.

So you have a poor excuse for a rifle, why not just run a slug?
With TAP et al you get less power, less accuracy, slower followups and no advantage gained from the greater hit probability that comes with a bigger spread.
A slug would be a far better option than TAP if "spread = bad".

[panzerr]

NOBODY is implying a shotgun is superior to a carbine.

and

Nobody is implying a shotgun can do the work of a carbine.

If all I had is a shotgun, I would take one with a vang comp mod to keep my shot tight. If I am trying to survive the end of the word as we know it and need to kill a bird to feed the family, I will be happy to have a tighter pattern so I get more reach. If I need to kill a man, and don't have access to slugs, at least I will put a wad of lead in a more compact zone to deliver as much tissue damage to one area as possible.

[terrymo]

JodyH

My Colt 6920 is my rifle, my shotgun is a shotgun. I am not confusing the two or their capabilities. In my occupation I have administrative, civil, and criminal consequences for any projectiles that do not hit the intended target. Hit probablility with buckshot from my perspective is having the greatest odds of keeping all projectiles from a round on its intended target. With buckshot that means a tight pattern creating multiple wound channels in the center of mass of the threat. I do not have the luxury of "greater hit probablity that comes with a bigger spread."

[JodyH]

After watching thousands of rounds go downrange in shotgun classes and 3 gun matches I've come full circle on what I though the optimal load for a shotgun is.
I used to be a TAP guy. Those 4" groups at 15 yards look cool at the range.
Then I re-evaluated what a shotgun does best and the role it plays in my self defense plan.
If you dislike my choice in #00, then you'd really hate my #4 Buck, same 10" dia. pattern @15 yards but 27 pellets instead of 9.
It's all a matter of what role you want the gun to serve and understanding exactly why you choose the load you do.

This reminds me of some peoples hand wringing about rounds that over penetrate but they don't even think about the horrible hit percentages even trained people have in gun fights.
If I shoot 3 rounds and 1/3 of my pellets from each shot miss completely, that's 9 stray pellets.
If you manage to hit with 2 of your 3 shots of TAP (66% hit ratio is FAR above the average) you just sent 9 pellets downrange unaccounted for.

[terrymo]

Then we will respectfully agree to disagree