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Thread: Who is making the most accurate DMR Uppers?

  1. #21
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    My comment about Les Baer is simple. Anyone who puts a castle nut on backwards and claims that it is due to "extensive testing and experience" is totally laughable.

    As for Wilson. As far as I know their bolts and stuff are not HP/MPI tested and inspected. I am more a "fanboy" of reliability.

    My Noveske upper was 1200.00 or so back in early 07. I built the lower and added the stock, etc...In all I had less than 1700.00 into it. I was using a Leupold Mk4 MR/T 2.5x8 in a one piece mount. With PP ammo I was shooting around 1.25 MOA. With BH it was even better.

    Just pointing that out because most people (me included) cannot even shoot to the potential of their weapon. If you really need accuracy and are shooting from a bench then maybe the overall performance isn't that important. To me reliability is king.



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  2. #22
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    I wonder how anybody gets anything useful in terms of information after a thread like this. What a joke that I am fanboy for BCM or that I have an agenda against the other companies....I guess I will yield to the much more experienced top poster in this thread.

    Good luck op, I find that the best accuracy guarantees come outta gun rags
    Last edited by ALCOAR; 02-23-11 at 00:48.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRIDENT82 View Post
    I wonder how anybody gets anything useful in terms of information after a thread like this. What a joke that I am fanboy for BCM or that I have an agenda against the other companies....I guess I will yield to the much more experienced top poster in this thread.

    Good luck op, I find that the best accuracy guarantees come outta gun rags
    There was lots of useful info in this thread. But you have to admit saying all the manufactures lie about accuracy except BCM was a pretty dumb thing to say. With all due respect to you. And I do apologize for the fanboy comment

  4. #24
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    How is this....

    If company A, B, C offer you a "super accurate" accuracy guaranteed claim.....

    And company D tells you that they are sorry they don't offer a gun rag guarantee due to the fact that they believe in not deceiving or otherwise misleading potential customers by giving a useless at best figure (A.K.A. what the Gun mfg. under the most perfect conditions, using a custom worked up hand load, mechanically fired, etc. can shoot with their said rifle or barrel) for an accuracy guarantee claim.

    I dont own a rifle from any of those 4 companies, can you say that you don't own a Lother Walter barrel, and by extension I guess whoever uses those types of barrels? Put that Lother against a Krieger or a Rock.
    Last edited by ALCOAR; 02-23-11 at 02:08.

  5. #25
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    Eh, I'd probably just grab an off the rack DD middy, throw on an ACOG and go have some fun.
    Last edited by variablebinary; 02-23-11 at 05:30.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRIDENT82 View Post
    How is this....

    If company A, B, C offer you a "super accurate" accuracy guaranteed claim.....

    And company D tells you that they are sorry they don't offer a gun rag guarantee due to the fact that they believe in not deceiving or otherwise misleading potential customers by giving a useless at best figure (A.K.A. what the Gun mfg. under the most perfect conditions, using a custom worked up hand load, mechanically fired, etc. can shoot with their said rifle or barrel) for an accuracy guarantee claim.

    I dont own a rifle from any of those 4 companies, can you say that you don't own a Lother Walter barrel, and by extension I guess whoever uses those types of barrels? Put that Lother against a Krieger or a Rock.
    I really don't understand why you are carrying on about this. Manufactures can and do offer an accuracy garrantee everyday. The firearm is test fired on a bench to see what groups it is capable of shooting. This is pretty cut and dry. If a weapon is not up to snuff when test fired it's looked at and gone over. No one LIES to anyone when firearms are bench tested. Below is one such test chart from my Wilson 1911. This is how garrantees are given.. It's NOT what the customer can actually shoot mind you... its what the firearm is capable of shooting.



    So in this case Wilson can state that this firearm can shoot 1 inch groups or better.. Is that a lie? are they misleading the consumer? I think not..

    I would bet that the reason BCM doesn't state any accuracy claims is more due to the fact that the rifles are really not set up for accuracy as much as the are set up for CQB.. and any accuracy testing would not shead any good light on the weapon..

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by venuto View Post
    I would bet that the reason BCM doesn't state any accuracy claims is more due to the fact that the rifles are really not set up for accuracy as much as the are set up for CQB.. and any accuracy testing would not shead any good light on the weapon..
    How exactly is an 18", rifle gas, SPR contour stainless barrel set-up for CQB?

    Dude, WTF are you talking about??

  8. #28
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    Any quality SS barrel is going to sub MOA with good ammo. In the last 15 years I've seen just about every high end SS barrel on someone's HP rifle, and they all hold sub MOA accuracy. None of those barrels came with an accuracy guarantee. Wanting a barrel that shoots out to 600m means weight. The barrel profile is going to have an effect on accuracy, and the longer the range the you want, the heavier the profile you'll need. Short answer is there is no free lunch. Given all the options, I'd go with the best parts, which means whomever does the bets QA\QC would get my business, not who offers the most guarantees.

  9. #29
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    The guaranteed groups are BS because they are all almost a single 5 round group shot in controlled conditions.


    I don't think a single 5 round group is indicative of a guns accuracy. Just like the bubbas at the range who shoot a 3 round group well, once, and then forever and ever they claim the gun is sub-MOA accurate.


    That accuracy may or may not be repeatable by the customer. Most likely not depending on how the factory testing was done. If its in a controlled environment with a mechanical test fixture its almost impossible for a human to have the same level of consistency.


    Ive owned some LaRue guns and they shoot really well, better than I can, but there are other good brands out there too. As far as advertising goes I would hope someone looking to shoot precision guns would know a single 5 round test group is just that.. a single 5 round group most likely shot in controlled conditions. That doesn't mean you are going to be able to repeat that on the range. Ranges have all kinds of things like wind, shadows, sun in your eyes, other people shooting 4ft away, might be cold or hot, ect ect ect...


    I would just pick one of the better known names, and run it. Most likely you will get a gun that shoots better than you can anyways. Theres not a whole lot of practical difference between a .75MOA gun and 1MOA when the majority of the error is going to come from you and the environment.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by decodeddiesel View Post
    How exactly is an 18", rifle gas, SPR contour stainless barrel set-up for CQB?

    Dude, WTF are you talking about??
    Forget it.. It's not worth a debate.. a 18 inch wouldnt be set up for CQB..

    This whole rant was started when manufactures (except BCM of course) were accused of lieing about accuracy claims. Nothing more or less.. I don't believe any good manufacturer actually lies in this way.. Call me nieve.. There are compaines that actually stress accuracy in their weapons so as to set themselves apart from others.

    Also, the mechanical accuracy of a rifle on a bench is very different then actual shooting conditions would dictate.. It's kinda a moot point unless you are a benchrest shooter.. If that were the case you most likely wouldn't be using an AR platform in the first place..
    Last edited by venuto; 02-23-11 at 13:35.

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