"super" Dave Harrington class in Ohio

**nyeti** · 11-13-06, 01:57

Here lies the key to taking the "right" class for you. In today's training world quagmire, you have some folks teaching stuff they have no business teaching, and students taking classes where they don't belong. I am seeing this more and more. Lifetime civilians using some sort of hobby cop background getting a nomex flight suit and teaching "advanced hostage rescue" courses, and Joe average guy taking "Advanced SWAT operator" classes.

Tailor the class and the instructor to each other. There are some guys who do a great job training civilians with carbines and some truely sensible, applicable skill sets with a variety of weapons. Clint Smith comes to mind here. Someday I hope to be healthy enough to take a Super Dave class. From everything I have heard from Dave's circle is he is a lousy choice for a civilian looking to take a class, but REALLY good for veteran professional trigger pullers to finely hone the basic skills they already have. Good AAR, sounds like a tough class, but worthwhile, and rewarding in being able to make it through.

**jjw** · 11-13-06, 12:19

Originally Posted by Cato

Sounds mighty unsafe. I don't know if this class was advertised as suited for civilians, but am I the only one who thinks that team (larger than two) drills make absolutely no sense in a civilian class? "Civilian" may be defined here as a good portion of law enforcement officers too.

IMHO all it does is promote unsafe movement and muzzle control while people stumble around in teams. Weapon handling and tactics may be different from the things suited for the lone "operator". So, even with this being an advanced class, I would rather go home and have practised the techniques suitable for me under a watchful eye longer, than learn dozens of techniques of very limited value to me.

Besides- and this is a general observation from social/group psychology- forming a team with guys who will never act together is a waste of time since the experience can't be transfered 1:1 to other teams or generalized.

unsafe i dont think so
if people who read the thread were intimdated they stayed away. steve did a great job in spite of what he says. hell even the cops were a little put off by dave. having known and shot with him for years i knew what was coming. hi speed ? u bet.
every 1 in the class was vetted by myself and t.d.l. before he left the country. we knew exactly who was coming. steve was qualifed enough that he was only 1 of 3 civilains in the class of 19. he was never anything but a pro.

also the specifics of what was going to be taught were CLEARLY STATED in the offering. hi speed -- big boy rules apply. no 1 was at the school that we did not know the qualification of. was it fast sure. it was offered as such. go back and read my original post. if was not for kids. it was for serious players only not wannabe's and safe queens toys.

again it was not for everyone.

best

jjw (b.l. farley)

p.s.

GRANT. read the business card in the envelope tks for the heads up.

**C4IGrant** · 11-13-06, 15:55

Originally Posted by Cato

Sounds mighty unsafe. I don't know if this class was advertised as suited for civilians, but am I the only one who thinks that team (larger than two) drills make absolutely no sense in a civilian class? "Civilian" may be defined here as a good portion of law enforcement officers too.

IMHO all it does is promote unsafe movement and muzzle control while people stumble around in teams. Weapon handling and tactics may be different from the things suited for the lone "operator". So, even with this being an advanced class, I would rather go home and have practised the techniques suitable for me under a watchful eye longer, than learn dozens of techniques of very limited value to me.

Besides- and this is a general observation from social/group psychology- forming a team with guys who will never act together is a waste of time since the experience can't be transfered 1:1 to other teams or generalized.

I think Civy's should get more used to looking down the business end of a weapon. The simple reason is that when is hits the fan, that is what is going to be happening. If the Civy shooter is not comfortable with this, then they shouldn't be in these types of classes.

I am now to the point that if someone isn't shooting from behind me, I get nervous.

C4

**C4IGrant** · 11-13-06, 16:03

Originally Posted by jjw

unsafe i dont think so
if people who read the thread were intimdated they stayed away. steve did a great job in spite of what he says. hell even the cops were a little put off by dave. having known and shot with him for years i knew what was coming. hi speed ? u bet.
every 1 in the class was vetted by myself and t.d.l. before he left the country. we knew exactly who was coming. steve was qualifed enough that he was only 1 of 3 civilains in the class of 19. he was never anything but a pro.

also the specifics of what was going to be taught were CLEARLY STATED in the offering. hi speed -- big boy rules apply. no 1 was at the school that we did not know the qualification of. was it fast sure. it was offered as such. go back and read my original post. if was not for kids. it was for serious players only not wannabe's and safe queens toys.

again it was not for everyone.

best

jjw (b.l. farley)

p.s.

GRANT. read the business card in the envelope tks for the heads up.

Hey BL, stay away from the truck!

And for those of you that took SD's class via 10-8: "There is no spoon!"

C4

**bigbore** · 11-13-06, 19:10

Boy you kids can complicate things. I wrote my AAR on the “dramatic” side to get the point across to folks that “Super Dave’s” class is not like any other class I have been to or heard of. Anyone who knows me or follows my posts, knows I am far from anything “tactical”. The “Warrior Mindset” isn’t even a twinkle in the back of my mind.

I honestly believe a majority of the “Tactical Carbine” courses being offered are nothing more than an e-command fantasy camps. An excuse for all the gear qeers to dress up in their latest combat costume and pretend they are training for TEOTWAWKI. They’re having fun, and may actually learn a thing or two.

I hope some of the e-commandos read my AAR and realized they are better off not signing up for a Super Dave class.

I hope some of the people who carry guns for a living read my AAR and jump on the opportunity if they get the chance to train under Super Dave.

Thank you BL for getting me into the class, I don’t regret it for a minute. It was well worth the time and money.

If I heard of an advanced Super Dave carbine class, I would have no interest in attending. I don’t carry a carbine for a living, and it would obviously not be a class for me.

If there is ever an advanced Super Dave handgun class, I’d be the first in line. I carry a handgun every day.

Again, Thanks BL for the class and if anyone has any specific questions shoot me an email steve@adcofirearms.com and I’ll be happy to help clear up anything else.