Martial Arts

[Pax]

Though I've never done Gi BJJ and as a result do not understand when collar chokes would even be available I still have never heard of any qualified and respected BJJ instructor preaching the use of common t-shirt collars for any type of choke. If you have any evidence to support this, I'd be very interested in it.

Theoretically speaking, I simply dont like the idea of relying upon my opponent's shirt fabric because A. why would I rely on the strength of cotton when there are so many other submissions available to me that do not rely upon anything but my ability to control his body and B. I cannot dictate what my opponent in a realistic defensive scenario would be wearing. We cannot presume that his collar will be made of denim, and in a realistic scenario, I'm sure as shit not going to be gentle with him.

[StrikeFace]

Pax,

I'm sure you're already aware, but I'll share it for the good of the thread: the value of gi training is the Suck Factor and the Slip Factor.

The Suck Factor is pretty obvious. Heavy cotton uniforms are brutal to fight in because they're hot and create friction during contact. If you can succeed in a heavyweight gi with all its limitations, you're going to really ruin someone's day in comfortable street clothes / fight shorts.

The Slip Factor comes in to play with guys that only train in fight shorts like they're the next Ultimate Fighter or something. Once you get sweaty, you can brute force your way out of a lot of things that you can't do in jeans, a jacket and boots out on the street.

2 cents.

[Sensei]

During my last deployment to A-stan, a group of us BJJ enthusiasts met 3 times per week for a couple of hours of roll time. The question of Gi vs no-Gi came up since some preferred to roll in PT's while other liked BDU's. So, we actually performed a little non-scientific experiment whereby we made some of the local garb (Hajib) using materials from the Haji Shop. Most agreed that rolling in a Hajib vs. BDU is very similar to Gi BJJ, and we therefore spent most of our time training in BDUs.

I've also noticed that Gi BJJ translates very closely to street clothes in Winter months. Don't get me wrong, there is definitely a value to training no-Gi. I just spend 80% of my time rolling Gi and it works for me.

[Pax]

Decent point. I certainly dont wear grappling clothing when training. I feel like I get enough friction during classes with just a regular t-shirt and polycotton shorts but I understand your point.

[munch520]

Though I've never done Gi BJJ and as a result do not understand when collar chokes would even be available I still have never heard of any qualified and respected BJJ instructor preaching the use of common t-shirt collars for any type of choke. If you have any evidence to support this, I'd be very interested in it.

Hey Pax - never seen this taught as part of organized instruction. I rolled pretty regularly and the guy that was typically my partner got me in a full gi a few times and demonstrated this. I wasn't referring to using a regular TShirt for this move, only a gi. It's been 2 years so I can get a hold of him and ask him what the exact terminology is for what he showed me. I'm almost positive one was from side control with the controller using the bottom part of the front of his gi to choke opponent. The other is fairly basic, is from a mount, and is the cross collar choke, as demonstrated here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tr-9...eature=related

again, Tshirts and the like would probably rip under this circumstance so it's not as practical outside traditional BJJ. Nonetheless, a very powerful choke as the competitor in a mount is using large muscle groups and body weight to lock lock the choke. Also, the gi AND the forearms of the competitor in mount are serving to choke the opponent.

[amac]

OP, these are all good suggestions. The question is, what are you training for? What do you want to be prepared to handle? Personally, I started Krav over a year ago and feel it's a great SD technique and easy to learn and rely upon if found in a hostile situation. What's more, if you want to get in shape, a Krav class will burn nearly 1,000 calories per class. It's very explosive, uses natural body reflexes and extremely punishing to your opponent.

I would add that Krav is incomplete when it comes to ground game. Most encounters/fights go to the ground. I thought about BJJ, but simple Judo or Jujitso should assist with balance, throwing and rolling.

Decide what you want to prepare for, then proceed to train. Every discipline has its advantages. Find the right one for you. Let us know what you decide.

[PT Doc]

I can vouch for 2 schools in the Atlanta area:
1) Alliance BJJ: This is Romero "Jacare" Cavalcanti's flagship school in the US. Alliance is the current world champion team with affiliate schools all over the world. I trained at an affiliate in Charlotte for a couple of years until the untimely death of the local instructor. Jacare has trained many of the world's top players (Fabio Grugel, Marcello Garcia, Ruben Charles, etc.) He was making trips to Ft Benning long before the combatives program started - I actually met him in the 1990's and got bitten by the bug. This is a great school if you want top-shelf sport BJJ or if you travel and want to roll at an affiliate, but I don't think that his school is doing much striking at this time (check the schedule since he often has striking coaches work with his grapplers)

2) Roberto Traven: Roberto is a former Jacare student, world champ, and now has a growing international BJJ organization. Atlanta is also his flagship and his gym is at unit2fitness. They have a robust striking, fitness, and MMA program. I train in Charlotte at a RT affiliate, and our school dominated the NC NAGA tournament.

Basically, you have a ton of options in Atlanta - enjoy.

Both of these places have very good reputations in the area.
Two other places that I can personally recommend:

http://www.thehardcoregym.net/index.php

Hardcore is in Athens and run by Adam and Rory Singer who are black belts under Roberto Traven. They have an outstanding program and facilities.

http://www.paulcreighton.com/

CMMA is in Suwanee and where I currently train. Paul is a black belt under Renzo Gracie. Great gi/no gi BJJ as well as standup and fitness classes and also great facilities.

Brian Stann is opening Warriors Legion Gym in Alpharetta next weekend and it should be top notch as well.

There are a ton of quality programs in the area. The metro area is huge and location comes into play due to drive times and class schedules. Any quality place will let you try a class before joining. Try a few and see which one feels right for you. Every place has it's own vibe and what is right for one guy isn't right for another.

[St.Michael]

A good style to pick is one you think you can do and will enjoy doing. Also as said above, you want to look at how it is used and if you really think it's going to work against XXX amount of people who might have weapons or friends.

Everyone today is really big on BJJ and that MMA stuff, but really there is a lot to take into account. I always hear people comparing Marital Arts to MMA fighters. The big "oh you wouldn't beat an MMA guy with martial arts". But you gotta look at the fact that those guys train all day and are professional athletes. Also as stated above the high kicks are great, but I gotta tell you there aren't many people who could land a solid high kick on the street. Ip Man used to say if I was going to high kick to your head does that mean I should punch your foot? It just doesn't make sense.

BJJ is cool, but if your wrestling around on the ground in a bar how long till someone jumps in and helps out his buddy and pounds you while your rolling around?

There are great martial arts that are mostly stand up that you can take like Kali, Aikido, Judo, Wing Chun. I don't know how old you are but consider that fact that if your going to get good at it then you will probably be training for a long time. Is the art you pick going to be something you want to do or will be able to do when you get older?

You just have to really search for a teacher. I have been studying Martial Arts in the Cleveland area for the last ten years and was in LA before that and went through a lot of teachers to find the one I am with now. I have trained in Kali, Aikido, very small amounts of Judo/JuJitsu, karate, Tae Kwon Do and have now settled into a wing chun school. Lots of schools now a days offer the ability to pay by the lesson too so go in and pay the 10 dollars for a lesson and try it a few times to see if you like it. Be leery of schools that want you to sign up for long periods of time in contracts. Those places are generally McDojos.

All martial arts are great in one form or another, but if your looking for something for a specific reason then you have to really search. Just like our firearms each one may be good for one thing but not the other.

[munch520]

Good points St.Michael, and good advice. At the end of the day I'd recommend any gym that offers tons of classes for a flat rate/month. I've enjoyed that, as I can pick and choose what to try and what to concentrate on. I think everyone would agree with the fact that no one discipline is complete by itself - and that gaining proficiency in a few is a great idea.

Also it was said somewhere above that all fights usually go to the ground. I would agree but also cite that this is the worst case scenario, IMO relating to defense, especially when outnumbered. I used BJJ, etc to supplement my ground game but I would not rely on that. In a defensive situation, when a fight goes to the ground...it's never good news. It's better news if you have the mount but even then your focus is on whomever is under you, and that guy's buddy will probably end up blind-siding you at some point. Make every attempt to stay on your feet! I know I'm at my quickest/most dynamic with two hooves on the ground...but I'm also long, gangly and somewhat inflexable.

Take care

[pmarc]

Also it was said somewhere above that all fights usually go to the ground. I would argue that this is the worst case scenario.

I remember seeing an explanation for that quote. IIRC, it came from a US police officer that referred to the fact that the suspect is usually on the ground prior to being handcuffed. That stems from the fact that is usually easier to control an individual who is lying on the floor with an officer on top and a gun pointed at him, than otherwise.

See this video for graphical explanation of how taking the fight to the ground could probably end.

Remember: the other guy also has friends. He is what we call in Kombato: EVAN (Enemy of bigger Volume, Armed or Numbers)

And now for a small plug: see the videos on youtube.com/kombato